Alternative Brake Master Cylinders -Using Stock Location
- Thread starter lookforjoe
- Start date
Dr.Jeff
True Classic
And changing to a floor mounted assembly isn't?
I'll be watching to see what you do with this Huss.
Dr.Jeff
True Classic
I was just giving you a hard time.
I saw those complete floor mounted pedal assemblies and had the same thought. They are all set up and easy to integrate as one unit. If the car was being converted to track-only use then I would certainly go that direction. However I can see the desire to keep the changes a little simpler overall (less total work involved) by just swapping the MC at the stock location. That being said, it would be much easier to do that with one 'tandem' style MC as was noted. EDIT: Adding a sample picture of these floor assemblies (this one is in a Miata):
dcioccarelli
Dominic Cioccarelli
You should simply message Stefan Högberg on Facebook messenger (stefan.hogberg.3) and ask him what he did. He is very responsive (I wanted to buy the Uno Turbo he took out before the swap).
Cheers,
Dom.
lookforjoe
True Classic
I was just giving you a hard time.
EDIT: Adding a sample picture of these floor assemblies (this one is in a Miata):
View attachment 28893
I recall my old Citroen having one of more pedal that pivoted off the floor - I didn't care for the 'feel'. I'd rather deal with hanging setup.
Unlike that Miata, we don't have the depth to 'recess' the assembly to avoid raising the entire pedal arrangement.
Thanks Dom! I had no idea who the pics belonged to, the album doesn't indicate. I will message him.
Started cutting up the spare pedal box, using those pics as reference
I welded the removed plate to one I cut from a Volvo PS mount bracket - I gauging the offset to be 1.5 - 2", based on those pics. I won't make the offset pieces until the MC's are here. The other piece of this is that the bushing and pivot rod have to be lengthened by the same amount. I have a spare bushing, the rod will probably have to be machined.
reshaped the brake pedal arm to get the offset back close to stock spacing of almost 4" - leaving it like this until I get the box offset done, if it's only 1.5", then the brake pedal will move to the appropriate offset without further adjustment.
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lookforjoe
True Classic
dcioccarelli
Dominic Cioccarelli
Hi Hussein,
he posts on the "X19 Enthusiasts Club" group. The specific post was this one. And this is his profile page. I think from there you can message him.
Cheers,
Dom.
dcioccarelli
Dominic Cioccarelli
Just thought of another option that hasn't been discussed (although a bit more extreme): you could use a floor mounted configuration like in a 105 series Alfa. I remember replacing the master cylinder in my 1750 in less than 30 mins as I just needed to crawl under the car!
Edit: it looks like it has been done already:
Cheers,
Dom.
lookforjoe
True Classic
Just thought of another option that hasn't been discussed (although a bit more extreme): you could use a floor mounted configuration like in a 105 series Alfa. I remember replacing the master cylinder in my 1750 in less than 30 mins as I just needed to crawl under the car!
Edit: it looks like it has been done already:
Cheers,
Dom.
Thank you Dom.
Lanciahf brought up floor mount setups on the last page
. Personally I don't want to mess with the whole driver/pedal/seating/steering arrangement. I like the orientation of everything as it exists, and raising the floor & pedal pivot setup alters the whole arrangement beyond where I would want to go. Probably have to raise the seat to regain the lost depth of the floor, and god knows where it goes from there. I'll stick with what seems to me the simplest approach
lookforjoe
True Classic
Thinking about shaft and bushing:
The bushing will be two parts, so the question is where to cut it, and how to make sure inner end of clutch leverage load on it it supported. I'm thinking to add a deep sleeve in what was the original outer location, so that both halves of the bush are properly supported. The brake pedal simply rotates on the bush, the clutch end side-loads the bushing, based on what I see in terms of bushing wear.
The bushing will be two parts, so the question is where to cut it, and how to make sure inner end of clutch leverage load on it it supported. I'm thinking to add a deep sleeve in what was the original outer location, so that both halves of the bush are properly supported. The brake pedal simply rotates on the bush, the clutch end side-loads the bushing, based on what I see in terms of bushing wear.
Dr.Jeff
True Classic
Ya, that stock bushing design is a bit oddball in my opinion. As you say, one pedal acts on it one way, and the other is different. And the whole thing is held from rotating by a tiny, thin tab that tends to wear into the soft bushing - allowing it to rotate when the pedal pivots get dry. That tears the bushing up and you have to locate a new one. I'm not fond of the whole design and considered doing it differently. But in the end I got lazy and just refurbished what was already there with several mods to hopefully make it work more reliably.
Perhaps take another look at what Bernice did to replace the bushing and see if it triggers any thoughts for your modified design:
https://xwebforums.com/forum/index.php?threads/that-plastic-pedal-box-bearing.25400/#navigation
Perhaps take another look at what Bernice did to replace the bushing and see if it triggers any thoughts for your modified design:
https://xwebforums.com/forum/index.php?threads/that-plastic-pedal-box-bearing.25400/#navigation
lookforjoe
True Classic
Thanks for the link, Jeff - it's timely as I have been communicating with her on this via the FB xWeb page
Edit: I actually posted in that thread, and promptly forgot all about it
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dcioccarelli
Dominic Cioccarelli
motoTrooper
True Classic
Interesting to see the solutions you create. I am surprised that the pedal box is so different than the Lancia Scorpion/Montecarlo. The steering column crash folds are concave rather than convex because the brake master is inside the box on the Lancia., but really very similar. I am going to mount a Tilton/Wilwood asssembly on the floor of my restomod. I think I have the room, and I'd like to make it (kinda) adjustable.
I enjoy your illustrations as well.
Enjoyed also your mask skills. I've also been making masks with latex. So fun to create.
We're probably weirdos.
I enjoy your illustrations as well.
Enjoyed also your mask skills. I've also been making masks with latex. So fun to create.
We're probably weirdos.
Dr.Jeff
True Classic
??? I must have missed this one. Do tell.
lookforjoe
True Classic
lookforjoe
True Classic
Thinking about how to address the bias bar. I really don't want to make the 'bias box" from scratch, i'd have to figure out pivot angles, blah blah, and I have no sources for lever parts. I found complete boxes online in the UK (nothing in the US???), once I figured out the search term. Not cheap & no idea if I can even make it work. I made a mockup based on the overall dimensions, so I'll see how that fits the space when I get home.
Stefan's version broken down:
What I leaning towards is modding the brake pedal & fitting the Bias bar sleeve where the existing pivot/push rod is now. That would make life simpler for sure, if I can make it work that way. Rough sketches:
Stefan's version broken down:
What I leaning towards is modding the brake pedal & fitting the Bias bar sleeve where the existing pivot/push rod is now. That would make life simpler for sure, if I can make it work that way. Rough sketches:
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dcioccarelli
Dominic Cioccarelli
What about something like this that comes with an integrated (adjustable) balance bar?
https://kaedings.com/part.php?part=1435&page=category&var=cat&id=28
Dom.
dcioccarelli
Dominic Cioccarelli
BTW: Look what I just found
http://160592857366.free.fr/joe/ebooks/Automative engineering books/Brake Handbook.pdf
Lots of interesting stuff in there!
Cheers,
Dom.