AMERICA'S CUP... I know this should be in...

Ian... I haven't read all the comments yet...

as I just got decent internet service to review the races...

They called it IMPROBABLE... I call it UNBELIEVABLE!

The 19th race said it all though as there were no "rules issues" and youse guys had a great start. Your boat also IMPROVED with speed as well but ours had improved a bit more. Friggin' amazing AND what a contest!

Now I'll go and read all the rest... Great jousting with ya!
 
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Bart... you seem to have a great knowledge as well...

as history behind this "tradition".

If you recall, and I'm sure Ian was there to witness it... the first America's Cup was won by an American yacht that first sailed over to England to compete, then sailed home again afterwards. The New York Yacht Club then further enacted rules such as all materials had to be NATIVE to the country that was competing and junk like that.

And I believe it was the Kiwi's (Frye???) that found some loopholes that really started to bring this form of competition into the late 1900's... Thank God!

And look at these machines today!!! Holy WOW! Just what the hell did the designers do to the Oracle boat and still kept it within the rules??? Hats off to the Kiwi engineers as well as BOTH boats improved in speed overall... Great racing!

I would like to see longer courses (twice around???) so that mistakes can possibly be made up for... but I doubt my heart can take much more of this! WOW what racing and the Kiwis (per se') are one hell of a great team and competitor!
 
As I said earlier, I don't know squat about sailing.

But it seems that the best technology and best financed team seems to win. Although it will probably never happen, I'd like to see the rules standardize on an old, wooden boat that you couldn't "tweak" to get a technological edge. That way, the best sailors, wherever they come from would win. For example, ever since their colonial days, the Portuguese have been great sailors, reaching their colonies in Brazil and the far east. Maybe something like this would level the playing field and make it more affordable for the best crew to win.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Mike
 
Actually Mike... I'd like to see the complete opposite!

Much like what happened when the Fry team came over with some 130 boat that had a boom longer that the 12 meter boats we were used to competing with.

I believe it was the Kiwis as well this time around that introduced the foils and it was Oracle a few moons back that affixed a rigid wing. The technology grew by leaps and bounds and the rules changed to suit them as well. Kinda like an unlimited class in any other form of racing but with some hopefully sensible rules to keep things safe.

If we did not try to stretch and bend and push the rules a bit... we'd be back where the Portuguese were in their wooden boats and bedsheets for sails.

BTW... a GOOD sailor back then was basically a good navigator first. Not necessarily the fastest!
 
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Yep, I agree.........!!

.BTW... a GOOD sailor back then was basically a good navigator first. Not necessarily the fastest!.....

.....but we would be accused of being "silly ol' farts" if we stood up on our lecterns and preached all the time about "how it was in the good old days!"
This is how it is these days, guys - fastest, best looking (include male/female celebs in here), noisiest, RICHEST, they get all the accolades!
Bah, humbug (who used to say that - Mr Dithers?) - I'll crawl back into my cave again, and shut up! :sad:

cheers, Ian - NZ
 
I am sorry if you thought my name was "Bart" Tony. Andrew "Bart" Simpson was the English sailor that died when his Swedish vessel pitchpoled ( one reason why I dislike the current rules ). A Gold medal Olympian and talented sailor - may he rest in peace. I was just noting remembrance at the end of my post to someone who lost their life in the name of sport. Hence RIP.

I have followed the Americas Cup since I was a little fella sailing Moths ( I still have the one I hand built from plywood as a kid swinging off the rafters ). The Jug is often the cutting edge of what is possible and just as I dislike current Moths ( bloody hydrofoils that an old fart like me has difficulty jibing) the edge sometimes leaves the 'romance' of sailing' behind as a liability. I love the ocean and have enough experience of the water to know that you should never turn your back on her or take her for granted. Yes for me she has all the traits of a woman, good and bad. ( oooh that will get me in trouble - AGAIN ).
This loophole stuff you mention has been going on before even the late 1900's when the NYYC adopted the Corinthian Yacht Club rule and their Seawanhaka Rule was 'explored' when the English merged the Yankee sloop and British cutter designs. If you read any Kiwi papers the past week you would have been made aware of the technology aircraft use to automate modern rigid wings to achieve flight stability. Was Oracles automatic or manual IAW the regs? I don’t know as my eyes glazed over as that’s not what sailing is to me, skill on the water with a sailing craft is what interests me.

Yes the '£100 Cup' race was just a challenge to sail around the Isle of Wight but the Jug had no set of rules that were to be attached to it if the challenger won from what I know. Historical records were often more about propaganda than they were the truth back then. It was the America Syndicate that gifted it to the NYYC that attached the 'deed of gift' to the thing and it was named the Americas Cup after the vessel ( not the country ) BTW is it was not the 100 Guinea Cup but a hundred Pounds Cup (some say 100 Sovereign ). The Earl of Uxbridge just bought the Wine Jug 'off the shelf' from a well regarded silversmith, it was not unique or one of a kind, I think there were six. The same mob that repaired it after the Kiwis failed to secure well enough and a local Maori political activist went nuts and smashed it up in a vandal attack in Auckland in 1997, Garrards the original London jeweler fixed it.

Yes I agree with the tenant of what you are saying regards the original 'Deed Of Gift' to the NYYC. The 'rules' as I understand them can be set by the winner and the challenger must then be subservient to them. The deeds were handed back to the survivors of the original syndicate by the NYYC a few times and the sail across the ocean thing as put in and out, that was a result of the politics of nautical evolution at the time. The way it works now I think the NYYC has all rights to the deed, but I am not a lawyer so don't bank that (actually have a distaste of lawyers).

But you hint at the biggest misunderstanding the rules are not a static concept, they can be changed by the winner (defender), a technological race has always been a tenant. I don't know that the boundaries are as mature as they had been in the past as it now reminds me of a petulant teenager that has no boundaries at all - my thoughts/opinion are obviously a reflection that I am an old fart, just writing this stuff scares me how much I have become like my old man. Over the life of this challenge the rules have been in 'almost' constant transition and there have been a few major rewrites. My two favorite periods have been the J' Class and the 12M classes ( the 12s because I have lived when they were racing ). When I first took an interest in electronics I built a fiberglass R/C replica of a 12Metre as a kid she is about 7 ft high and it's in a big box in the shed, on the stand and in the water she looks pretty, the lines are beautiful - the AC 45/72 machines looks like Megatron – a Transformer for the water yuck!!. A Terstarossa is a supercar but I don't think it is pretty, a friend had one and I thought it was as fugly as sin in the flesh - to work on it proved to be a penal sentence so he hardly drove it.

The wholesale change that made the 'country of origin' as I understand it was made by a country that has no access to an ocean and sailed off the coast of Spain, the whole 2010 legal junket was confusing and I just lost interest in the whole contest. The lawyers had a field day before that event even got started and untold damage was done to what is a great tradition. Words got twisted/inverted and the 'intention' of the deed got obscured, a lot of this has been going on and why America turned up in a catermaran against a monohul - that was just sad. America wanted to continue racing the 12s but a Kiwi Merchant Banker wanted to interpret the original deed and turned up in a monster monohull. I know Connors wanted to race 12s but the Kiki banker insisted with a massive monohull. I understand the desperation to 'interpret the rules ( and get away with it ) but that is the very point in time the lawyers took over and the sailors just became just one small part of the overall project. When you use a lawyer instead of playing the game the sportsmanship dies.


As I said previously that’s why I blame the Swiss for the current 'mess' the Jug is in. I've been in a warship that didn't sink when it bumped into a whale, run over a seal in an AC72 in full flight and you will be the passive bystander strapped on a Ferris wheel. Cats I don't feel are yachts and the Swiss are landlocked, their high-performance catamarans had been developed specifically for their lake, compound this with the USA 17 bringing a cat in 2010 with a rigid wing for a sail ( they decimated the Swiss on the water because of this ) leads us to a yacht race that were sailed by machines that are 1/2 hydrofoil - 1/2 airplane. Hardly a boat to most people, you can argue a stinkboat (Luxury Yacht ) that never leaves the mooring in Monaco or an ocean going Cat (Cruising Yacht ) is a yacht but I don't buy it. For centuries the Jug has been about racing yachts with sails and a single hull, change that and you are messing with the brand and its image - currently it is IMHO tarnished.

The problem is that the deed is a Trust Document that is registered in the NY Supreme Court, how do you get rid of lawyers and judges that have less that 25 years of personal experience 'on the water', which may bring some sanity to this farce. The rubbish that went on in 2010 did just that it went on and on and on, they were about to start the races and they were still arguing in court - eventually having to withdraw litigation as the race was programmed to start and the deed talks about when it should take place. The mind just boggles if you can't agree with a set of rules and agree on a fair interpretation before a challenge is accepted and mounted, why the hell do we bother to call it a sport of international challenge. How do you give the regs an international representation, even if it is won by a foreigner the NYSC is still the arbiter and international representation seems suppressed. I am not saying it is - it just seems that way. (I can't imagine the scrutineer in my local amateur race series having no mechanical aptitude/experience telling me that I am not allowed to use spacers on my hubs as they are aftermarket). My 2 cents for bringing reputation back to the Auld Mug, product of Origin for boats / crew reinstated. Set some boundaries to the technology.
None of this will happen and I fear the Jug will just sit in the cupboard again for the next 20 years.


Sorry for the rant Tony the lack of sportsmanship (percieved or not) just annoys me.


Ian - a Sandgroper eh! then as a surrogate Fremantle Dockers supporter you will be just as gutted by the AFL Grand Final yesterday, I really thought this would be their year.



Being on the water with only the power of sail is to know peace
Sandy
 
AFL Grand Final......!

......Ian - a Sandgroper eh! then as a surrogate Fremantle Dockers supporter you will be just as gutted by the AFL Grand Final yesterday, I really thought this would be their year.......

Yep, we don't get a lot of Oz footy news here over the ditch, but I was disappointed that the Dockers lost out to those bloody Hawks (excuse me while I have a quick chunder :sad:).
But, to be honest mate, my real love of Ozzie Rules still remains back when I was living in Perth years ago, when West Perth was MY team, when stars like Polly Farmer and 'flying' Laurie Richards were the pin-up boys - ahhh, them were the days! :wink2:

cheers, Ian - NZ
 
I too meant no disrespect for Andrew Simpson...

I didn't even know his name and was looking for yours. I too am old (65) and like to sign as well as address those I speak and write to with at least their given names.

I also can't begin to really discuss or argue many of the points nor can I agree or disagree with many of them as well. I'm just not as much learned or up on all the goings-on around them as you apparently are.

I started my sailing career in an 8 foot Sabot and later on in life after serving ASHORE in the US Navy, I purchased a 13 foot cat-rigged Banshee racing hull which I began to master after a couple of years. What a hoot...

But then I witnessed several makes of catamarans making half again to twice the speed I was and it appeared EFFORTLESS as well as a kick when trapped out and flying. In '77 I purchased the very first Prindle 18 sold on the left coast (Hull #7, Sail #11) and owned that craft 20 years and actively sailed it for the first 10 for 10 months out of the year! It had a very tall aspect ratio sail with no more footage than the popular Hobie 16 and an assymetrical hull without daggerboards making it a kick to beach and launch, as well as lots of skill to get it to tack! Once mastered, with dual traps, a real kick to fly almost anywhere and anytime.

Hobie Alter seemed to popularize them but it would appear the natives to many of the South Pacific Islands found them to be the perfect combo to launch through the surf be they outriggers or catamarans... I mean why carry ballast when it isn't necessary?

Around the same time I saw lots of material development both in carbon fiber hulls and Mylar coated Dacron sails and that was just the start of what is transpiring today. Hobie Alter stuck to his guns in order to keep 225,000 cats competitive using strict rules and only factory authorized sails and rudders... and I believe he was right in doing so. He then went on to develop NEW classes to keep up with the technologies, and I think he was right again.

Anyway... now I'm starting to ramble... but enjoyed the discussion...
 
Well Ian, you'll be pleased to know the Falcons (or the Cardinals as they were back then) took the local premiership on Sunday. (I'm a staunch Lions - Subiaco - supporter)

I knew the Dockers would choke....

And lots of well put stuff Sandgroper... I found it a very entertaining and informative read.

I might have even raced Moths against you as a kid! I hung out a lot at Pelican Point in the summers, right next door to RPYC... spent a lot of time out on the water, until I got into cars.

SteveC
 
Good news, Steve.........!

......Well Ian, you'll be pleased to know the Falcons (or the Cardinals as they were back then) took the local premiership on Sunday......

.....I had forgotten they had a name change - back whenever it was!!
Ahhh, many a time I was there, barracking for the Cardy's at West Perth oval (now long gone, I believe).

.....until I got into cars......
Hmmm, that's a fate that befell most of us on this Forum, I guess Steve!! :help:

cheers, Ian - NZ
 
West Perth oval is still there ... just not a football ground anymore...been re purposed as something else and the area has become very trendy in recent years. My folks still live about 1.5km away...inner city living has become fashionable, so they are surrounded by town houses and yuppies.

SteveC
 
Gee, don't times change......!

...and the area has become very trendy in recent years.......

.....when I was living in Perth, 1969-75, I was working for Coca-Cola when the plant was then in Leederville.
Back then, most of the little old houses in that area were inhabited by pimps and their "girls", or old folks!
I was back in Perth in 2008, and I couldn't believe the transformation in that area - all trendy little boutiques where the Coke plant had been, and Leederville had become one of "the" places to live, if you had a spare $$mill. to spend! :shock:
Oh well, that's progress for ya (maybe :whistle:)!!

cheers, Ian - NZ
 
Well

Blow me down with a feather, how wrong was I, I’m actually stunned.
The Oatleys ( Aussie Wild Oats series racing boats ) have spoken up and said they will challenge. I doubt the winemaker has enough cash, dad and son are already talking about cutting the costs from day one and finding sponsors to come onboard to mount the challenge. They obviously think it’s too expensive where Spithill obviously doesn’t care how much it costs as ‘it’s not about the money’ – he’s a competitor and it’s about winning apparently. When he said that a bit of the old salty in me died, apparently racing for your country only matters if it is the Olympics. Perhaps if he is really a patriotic competitor he could do it for $12.50 a day, adjusted for inflation of course.

I am not sure how this early Challenger of merit will go, I thought the hand bag race series was a selection trial when multiple challengers fronted up. Does that mean that our colonial ‘masters’ will be excluded even if the Sir Ben gets a team together with a boat. That will go down like a lead balloon if us upstart ‘Colonials’ are selected as the only challenger.
Lets see how they travel over the next three years to the start line, one thing is for sure I am again interested.

Ian, I was converted to AFL when I attended Windy Hill in Victoria at one of the West Coast Eagles first matches when the league went ‘National’, that sealed my fate. NRL is as boring as watching refrigerators smash into one another, gladiatorial yes entertaining no. You are right about getting into cars, boats are like getting a bucket of money and trying to fill a hole in the water.

Steve, I’m not sure we would have due to the age difference. I may have a love of the water but I became aware early enough in my life that I just wasn’t good enough at it as the rest were. So I gave competition up early, looking back I am surprised at the depth of wisdom at such a young age. If only I was as smart in the other spheres of my life. Competitive I am not but I just enjoy sailing, doing 17 knots in a Hobie 18 across Cockburn Sound is as competitive as I get. It was good for 4 up and effortless for a day trip, two up and on the trapeze is a stiff breeze it was a weapon that would spit you out as quick as look at you. I had flipped the thing a few times when the Freo Doctor got a bit too happy and that chop gets up. I guess this is where my prejudice for monohulls in the Americas Cup comes from. I have the same opinion as Syd Fisher – Cats are not good on the big ocean. If the Hamilton Yacht Club gets the nod I think that won’t be a problem. The tourist establishments up there would welcome the Cup and the sailing venue would be spectacular.

Tony, please don’t get hung up on the names thing, my friends call me Sandy. All of the stuff I threw on the message board should be easily available ‘on the net’ – I wouldn’t be surprised if I got something wrong somewhere – no one is perfect, I certainly ain’t and memories are often imperfect. I will swear on one bit though the Kiwi boss did throw himself on the boardwalk in Fremantle, he was adamant that no one was going to drill holes in his boat. The words ‘over my dead body’ were used and he had a good sense of humour and laid down in front of the vessel when the scrutineers came to poke holes on his fibreglass wonder. I pizzed myself laughing, those things you don’t forget.
Your exploits on the water sound ‘interesting’, I see where you are coming from now about the AC72s, that is not what I thought the Cup was about though - after today’s announcement I guess there is no going back. Ballast is good when the ocean conditions get heavy and you have to de-power, in a cat you become a cork or spend your time pretending to be a submarine.
Alter indeed kept up with materials and the 33 monohul was interesting but I could never understand dropping the 18, the symmetrical hulls with a pair of daggers the 8:1 mainsheet would see you scoot along on the trapeze wires. Solid too only had minor breakages and never rigging – fatigue on the rudder castings were the main worry but I put that down to the EPO rudders being so rigid, sadly she is gone. Seriously a beach launch is no harder than a Prindle and I have sailed a H-18 Solo, the daggers are easy-as to set, the jib is the hard bit. A Prindles’ simple rig is an advantage if you don’t want to mess with adjusting the sail area, that and the daggers are probably the only two major differences. I will fess up and say that as we had heaps of ramps to use so the H-18 got a trailer launch most of the time, the Prindle is similar in weight isn’t it?
I did a ¼ century in our Navy and served in one of your FFGs we painted them grey and used them as tier 1 warships. Oliver Hazard Perry Class, did a Sonar dome in a ‘rub’ with a whale. Worst weather was before that sailing thru the eye of a typhoon in the South China sea ( she was very angry that day ), with one boiler out from water down the stack I got a bit worried. Never lost a man on any ship I was on though.
Good chinwag, ta

As they say in the Puss ‘antifalsh removed
 
Sandy... My replies between the lines...

Well


Tony, please don’t get hung up on the names thing, my friends call me Sandy.

Well, I just kinda grew up that way and enjoy it when folks (like you) address me by name. What I enjoy, I think others will as well. Sure eliminates a bit of confusion as well. If you had not address your paragraphs to Ian and Steve, I would have been confused by its contents.

All of the stuff I threw on the message board should be easily available ‘on the net’ – I wouldn’t be surprised if I got something wrong somewhere – no one is perfect, I certainly ain’t and memories are often imperfect. I will swear on one bit though the Kiwi boss did throw himself on the boardwalk in Fremantle, he was adamant that no one was going to drill holes in his boat. The words ‘over my dead body’ were used and he had a good sense of humour and laid down in front of the vessel when the scrutineers came to poke holes on his fibreglass wonder. I pizzed myself laughing, those things you don’t forget.

He was indeed quite a "character" and really ruffled the feathers of the entire sailing community, WORLDWIDE!

I have trouble remembering the specifics as well but we are now living with the results of all those calamities... and I gotta say I think overall its a good thing!


Your exploits on the water sound ‘interesting’, I see where you are coming from now about the AC72s, that is not what I thought the Cup was about though - after today’s announcement I guess there is no going back.

I enjoyed sailing actively for over 10 years and then the family moved on to other interests. I'm not sure what you mean by "interesting", as the term is NOW used quite frequently as a polite way of saying "boring or ugh!" I'm going to take it as a compliment though... More of my "interesting" exploits later.

Ballast is good when the ocean conditions get heavy and you have to de-power, in a cat you become a cork or spend your time pretending to be a submarine.

I can't remember the EXACT figures but they, as you say, are probably still available online. A Prindle 18 weighs about 300 pounds to the Hobie 18's 400+. The Prindle had about the same about of total sail area as a Hobie 16 with a tall aspect ration using a 29' 6" mast. I believe the Hobie 18 had 20 or 40 more square feet than the Prindle 18 with a mast 1 or 2 feet shorter.

Bottom line, my experience was that with a crew of two (Prindle required a minimum crew weight of 300 pounds) that the Hobie would run circles around a Prindle in light to moderate winds and the Prindle would really cook with moderate to heavy air.


One time I handed the tiller to a friend a we were running almost directly downwind with my 7 year old son aboard in Mission Bay CA.

I said do NOT pull in on the main as we were really scooting along and a few minutes later I hear click-click-click!

As soon as I turned back to him the hulls dug in and my son sitting on the other side of him was LAUNCHED forward. I flew like a 240 pound flag hanging on the the side-stay... and the boat fell back down on its feet and took off again.

It took us about 30 minutes to gather ourselves and tack back UPWIND to retrieve my son. I have always insisted everyone aboard wear lifejackets or sit ashore and this was a good "trial" of all sorts!

OTHERWISE though... there was so much hull forward and such little weight it would indeed submerge them now and again, especially with two out on the wires but never showed any hint of pitchpoling, just cookin' along! I never had that experience again, as well as never handing my friend control of my boat again...

On another day with I was sailing with an OLD sailor who could teach me more in ten minutes than I had learned in 10 years before. The wind really kicked up while we were outta Ventura CA and we decided we really needed to get back. With him and I we probably were about 350-380 pounds and with the main basically released and the jib loose we ran on a broad reach towards the shoreline. Our boat speed hadta be over 20 mph as we ran up and over the swells and actually LEFT the water... being blown sideways in the air, and then slamming down on the other side only to do it again over the next swell. SCARY and coulda been FUN if I was so goddam SCARED!

It was a first for him as well... Happened about 3 or 4 times before we hit the beach and kissed the sand after the boat was blown about 20 feet beyond the waterline up the beach sand!

Another "one and only" time for me... as I was feeling a bit too old way back then.

Alter indeed kept up with materials and the 33 monohul was interesting but I could never understand dropping the 18, the symmetrical hulls with a pair of daggers the 8:1 mainsheet would see you scoot along on the trapeze wires. Solid too only had minor breakages and never rigging – fatigue on the rudder castings were the main worry but I put that down to the EPO rudders being so rigid, sadly she is gone. Seriously a beach launch is no harder than a Prindle and I have sailed a H-18 Solo, the daggers are easy-as to set, the jib is the hard bit. A Prindles’ simple rig is an advantage if you don’t want to mess with adjusting the sail area, that and the daggers are probably the only two major differences. I will fess up and say that as we had heaps of ramps to use so the H-18 got a trailer launch most of the time, the Prindle is similar in weight isn’t it?

I agree, with all said here, and I do lean to "simplicity" quite often. The assymetrical hulls of a Prindle made tacking a task that had to be mastered... with keeping the jib reversed (kinda like sometimes done with a roll-tack) and the bows DOWN by placing weight forward, and then having the air blow the bow(s) around, before releasing the jib, popping the battened main and the re-trimming both.

Launching and retrieving was on par but as I said earlier, the Hobie was at least 100 pounds heavier. The Hobie will tack EASILY on its centerboards compared with the "long centerboard" of the Prindle. If you just push on the side of hull of a Prindle idling in the water... It tends to pinch forward and straight! Many a sailor who THOUGHT beaching their Prindle and facing it into the wind when the breeze was coming off the water... has ran helplessly after their boat as it "walked" its way off the beach... then headed out to China with an absolute NEUTRAL weatherhelm!

I did a ¼ century in our Navy and served in one of your FFGs we painted them grey and used them as tier 1 warships. Oliver Hazard Perry Class, did a Sonar dome in a ‘rub’ with a whale. Worst weather was before that sailing thru the eye of a typhoon in the South China sea ( she was very angry that day ), with one boiler out from water down the stack I got a bit worried. Never lost a man on any ship I was on though.

I hadta go to Google to insure I knew an FFG was a Guided Missile Frigate. I see WE later renamed many of them as DEG and DDG's. Most were decommissioned though with new technologies. So you actually retired then as a lifer? I spent 3 years, 10 months and 11 days with my last tour ashore in DaNang RVN. I spent two years prior doing passive ASW work in Coos Bay Oregon and a year prior to that with Boot Camp and A schools. With a family of a wife and two young boys, I saw 50% of my time in the Navy would be on "unaccompanied tours" and so far I didn't really enjoy my time so far. I had at least another year of "sea duty" before me and this last one looking like a Marine in 'Nam was the straw that tipped the scales!

I was an ETN2, Petty Officer Second Class, Communications... and worked on lots of ASW equipment as well as TTY35's, R59A receivers and several portable and fixed transmitters and antennas. Much of the ASW gear was modified communications equipment made by Western Electric and AT&T. When I left the Navy and joined the Phone Company locally a month later, I ran into much of the same equipment. Is there any doubt we are not "watched over"???

Good chinwag, ta

As they say in the Puss ‘antifalsh removed

Same to you... I think... HA!
 
F1 Designer looks to take to the water

Adrian Newey is at Red Bull and looking to move on. Methinks the Englanders want the Auld Mug back, Formula One on water.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...ewey-help-win-Americas-Cup-Great-Britain.html



I only bumped into this article when looking into the F1 failures experienced by Mercedes in Canada, perhaps a chink in the 160hp electric drive system.

Congrats to the young rookie from Perth Western Australia on his fist F1 win.
 
Sandy... its been awhile... I never come here...

but was bored a bit and took a peek.

I know not either of these folks and rarely follow F1 anyway... but man, 23 Million pounds a year!!!

And he turns that down to go sailing?

I guess he must have an extensive background in hull/sail design as well as automotive design and America's Cup yachts are about as far apart as you can get!
 
Hey there Tony

Yeah me neither but I remembered this thread when I was reading about the Canadian F1 round and fell over the above Americas Cup article.

I know F1 isn't a big deal in the Americas, even SteveC drew the link to F1 at the last sailing event and thought it might peak some interest.

I find it interesting to follow the F1 engineering and the politics ( a few links at the end if you are interested in the Hybrid monsters ) as the races are often as uninteresting as circle racing to me because the tracks are just as tame. No poke at NASCAR intended - just say'in. First Ross Brawn and now Newey, F1 is going thru a transition with Aero enhancement becoming restricted so hopefully it will mean more variety in who steps on the podium at each round.

"Adrian Newey's IQ score is not a publicly available statistic, but in Formula One terms, he is a certified genius." He has had a hand at your Indy Car design and CART from the early 80's so I thought you lads may have heard of him, but is best known for F1 so I guess not.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...rom-red-bull-and-formula-1-shakes-up-the-grid


Adrian Newey actually turned down Ferrari and stayed with Red Bull so I guess when he has been on such a generous pay check for some considerable time that money ceases to be a motivating factor. Whilst Ferari was reported to have spat the dummy this week and rumored to leave F1 it won't happen - it is the main spar of their advertising model. I understand Newey is very talented and a good engineer / designer / manager and as ridiculous as it sounds aerodynamics in F1 and the 'mainsheet' on a AC72 Cat are similar. Air is air and weight is still the enemy I would guess. I would suggest that his advanced experience as a aerodynamicist with lightweight materials like carbon fiber and rare lightweight metals is why Ben Ainsley went to Quatar to speak to him. Money the Engladers now have it seems, I just found it interesting that they are pulling out all stops to put such a team together at this early stage. Be interesting to see what crazy flying machine they come up with this time, I have little doubt Red Bull will be emblazoned all over it.

Remember the English lost the first America's Cup in 1851 and have never won the Cup since creating the race challenge. That must sting.



Formula One

I miss the V8's because they now sound like a vacuum cleaner but these 1.6-liter V6 turbos punch 600HP the hybrid component adds another 160HP out of a 44 pound battery and takes braking energy. Which is why I read Hamilton cooked his rear brakes in Canada when the hybird parts went screwy - the rear brakes are not big enough now to do the duties by themselves and need the hybrid system to pull the car up consistently.

http://www.renaultsport.com/IMG/pdf/rsf1-moteur2014-presskit-en_final2.pdf

http://www.electric-vehiclenews.com/2013/06/renault-unveils-2014-hybrid-v6-turbo.html

http://jalopnik.com/how-formula-ones-amazing-new-hybrid-turbo-engine-works-1506450399



Oh and now that Porsche is back at endurance racing after a long sleep with their all-new LMP1 they proved that hybrids can sound awesome. Nearly took Le mans - nearly with the Aussie Mark Webber at the wheel. Both F1 and Le Mans are pushing Hybrid systems - facinating.

http://wtf1.co.uk/porsche-919-hybrid-engine/
 
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