Dropping Oil Pan

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Daily Driver
I have a seriously gunked up oil sump - at least on the outside. A very slow oil leak is bothering me more than the gunk but it's near impossible to figure out the source without cleaning it up. So I decided it might be good to drop the oil plan, clean it very well, install a new gasket (with the blue Hylomar joining compound), and go from there. I have two questions that aren't clear from N54 or other searches. #1, I know I will need to remove the cross member bar that blocks access to a few bolts. Some old posts suggest putting a 2x4 across the top of the engine bay and tie a piece of heavy rope under the tranny to support it. before unbolting the bar. Is this still the best approach vs. a jack from underneath? #2, Is it straightforward to get the sump off and are there any cautions or tips to know to limit issues when I open this things up? I want this to be a simple clean up job!

Thanks!
 
You are referring to the outside of the pan? Before doing all that I would use some sort of engine cleaner and wash the whole thing off. You would be able to tell if the oil were coming from the pan gasket... the upper parts of the engine would be dusty, rusty or both. Oil could come from lots of places but I would look at seals and it would not hurt to make sure the case is venting properly. I thought I had a leak from a fuel pump blanking plate but it turned out to be the dipstick not seated properly and probably the wrong weight oil. Change of oil and proper seating set it straight. You can buy leak detection dye and the UV light to go with for about $20 and that will save hours of your labor! To answer your question I would support drivetrain from above and leave yourself as much room as possible if dropping the pan... good luck!
Regards
 
I'm pretty sure I see droplets at 1-2 places along the gasket, as well as around the drain plug seal (that paper gasket is shot for sure). I think I will set things up to drop the pan and see how it goes!
 
You need to remove the trans support mount along with that crossmember - remove the two bolts and one nut that retain the mount to the bell housing, then remove the crossmember with the mount attached.

The pan has to be finagled off the motor - there is a baffle tray that will hang on the oil pickup tube. Just has to be tilted arounf until it comes free of the tube.

If you use the newer rubber gasket from Bayless no sealant is required. I wouldn't use sealant on the old style either, except for the corners where the end caps mate with the block. That should be the only place any sealant is required.
 
My oil pan is off and clean enough to eat from now... so to speak. This was a big job for me, but the most difficult part was getting 35 years of gunk off, cleaning the cross member, transmission mount, and other assorted panels I removed, plus hardware. I began to worry about reassembly procedure and decided I would report back here first with a few questions.
  1. Should I do anything in terms of maintenance to the pump while I have it exposed? (No issues that I am aware of).
  2. The pan is now clean and dry. I gently removed the tattered gasket and cleaned all the bolt holes, drain plug threads. Anything else to prepare the pan?
  3. For a paper gasket I see the advice to use sealant sparingly. Is sealant applied to both sides of the paper? I plan to attach to upper surface vs. pan.
  4. Is there a trick to get the oil pickup tube back in the right place through the baffle?
  5. How much torque should be applied to the 20 pan bolts so the gasket or aluminum isn't compromised?
Thanks all!
 
When I had my engine apart I took the lower cover and screen off the foot of the oil pump and found quite a bit of gasket material and slivers of various sealants.
oil_pump_screen_3.JPG
 
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My oil pan is off and clean enough to eat from now... so to speak. This was a big job for me, but the most difficult part was getting 35 years of gunk off, cleaning the cross member, transmission mount, and other assorted panels I removed, plus hardware. I began to worry about reassembly procedure and decided I would report back here first with a few questions.
  1. Should I do anything in terms of maintenance to the pump while I have it exposed? (No issues that I am aware of).
  2. The pan is now clean and dry. I gently removed the tattered gasket and cleaned all the bolt holes, drain plug threads. Anything else to prepare the pan?
  3. For a paper gasket I see the advice to use sealant sparingly. Is sealant applied to both sides of the paper? I plan to attach to upper surface vs. pan.
  4. Is there a trick to get the oil pickup tube back in the right place through the baffle?
  5. How much torque should be applied to the 20 pan bolts so the gasket or aluminum isn't compromised?
Thanks all!

Pan just has to be angled & jiggled to go back over the pickup tube...
if they are M6 (can't remember offhand), I would only go 12nm, I just snug them with 1/4 drive ratchet...
 
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I dropped a pan once and found same mess in pick up strainer... best to check while you are there. Here is a torque table
http://www.cncexpo.com/MetricBoltTorque.aspx
I would guess you might go with the lube torque? Unless the bolts and the block are cleaned and dry. I would think the most important part of torquing in this situation would be uniform torque so as not the deform the gasket or pan... which would not be as critical as with a pressed metal pan... just my thoughts
Regards
 
Thanks for the torque table. I will definitely clip this for later use. These are M6 x 1.0 bolts, which would mean a lubed torque of 69 for the 8.8 heads. Given the other values Fiat gives in their torque table this seems very high - especially for an aluminum pan. 12 seems on the low end of anything in the specs, but at least I know they are consistent and can always tighten up if I have leaks. Taking off the crossmember will be a breeze now that i know what I'm doing.

Here is a photo of the gunk I found in the foot of the oil pump. Thanks to you guys I pulled it off and checked it. Wow... yuck.

20161130_114712.jpg

And here is a photo of the cleaned up pan back on the crankcase. This level of cleanliness really highlights the other projects I could work on. Now I just need to replace the supports, fill it up, and leak test.

20161130_202548.jpg
 
Pay close attention to ft-lb vs in-lb 69 is inch-lb which would be 5.75ftlb. looks very nice! Good work. The transmission mount can be tricky to reinstall be sure to check it closely if if got oil soaked it may be that much closer to failure... I had a car that leaked in that area and the mount had a higher than normal failure rate because of it.
Regards
 
Just rechecked table the numbers in parentheses are inch-lb. I made the mistake of going ft vs inch when installing pressure plate once but realized my mistake after twisting the first bolt off! Reminds me of a saying my shipmates had regarding torque... " tight's tight, too tight's broke" not the way we want to go about this on our cars!
Regards
 
And here is a photo of the cleaned up pan back on the crankcase. This level of cleanliness really highlights the other projects I could work on. Now I just need to replace the supports, fill it up, and leak test.

What? No Paint on the oil pan?? ;)
oilpan_painted1.JPG
 
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I'm afraid painting an oil pan would start me down a path that only leads to more time under the car than driving it! ;)

So I guess I should loosen those bolts up a little bit since I left them somewhere between 10-12. Wouldn't want some vibration or movement on the road to lead to a crack or something. I definitely did NOT notice the inch-pound parenthesis, but will not miss this again.
 
So I guess I should loosen those bolts up a little bit since I left them somewhere between 10-12. Wouldn't want some vibration or movement on the road to lead to a crack or something.
I'd be inclined to leave them be, as slacking them risks uncompressing the gasket and starting up new leaks. It's more important that the torque be approximately the same at all the bolts than that it be exactly spot-on at 5.75.

And it's not as if most consumer-grade torque wrenches are especially accurate at those low values.
 
Coincidentally I came to the same conclusion and left them where they were. Tomorrow she gets started and we'll see if the oil leak is finally fixed. Thanks!
 
Update.... no oil leaks so far! Need to road test and see for sure.

But now I can clearly see coolant dripping down the side of the freshly cleaned oil sump. The side near the timing belt. I'm wondering if this is a leaky head or something simpler.
 
But now I can clearly see coolant dripping down the side of the freshly cleaned oil sump. The side near the timing belt. I'm wondering if this is a leaky head or something simpler.
Most likely something less worrisome/difficult/expensive than the head... There are many possible sources of leakage at that end: Both heater hoses, water pump and fittings, and (the sleeper!) the stud for the timing belt tensioner.
 
I am about to clean the sump on my X. Is there a sequence to tightening the sump bolts such as start in the middle and snug up the opposing bolts as you go around the pan? No matter how often I change the oil I can always drag some black gunk out wit a pice of air from the oil drain plug.
 
Is there a sequence to tightening the sump bolts such as start in the middle and snug up the opposing bolts as you go around the pan?
There's no sequence requirement in the shop manual, and the torques involved are small enough that you don't have to worry about distorting the pan if you do one end and then the other. But there's a lot to be said for doing a few at bolts at each end and first just to be sure that you have the alignment right and to stop the gasket from shifting on you.
 
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