Engine cover hinges
- Thread starter Ed Lord
- Start date
Ed Lord
Daily Driver
Thanks Rodger
Chris Obert
autocrosser, X driver
If Rodger, or anyone else does not have a spare, I have them new and used.
BTW, my notes show them as being the same all years. If you can correct that information I would love to know so I can correct my notes!
BTW, my notes show them as being the same all years. If you can correct that information I would love to know so I can correct my notes!
Ed Lord
Daily Driver
My understanding is the 1500 hinges are longer than the earlier hinges, and the ‘74 hinges are shortest of all
Ed Lord
Daily Driver
Thanks anyway.
Ed Lord
Daily Driver
Chris, let me know what you have.
Ed Lord
Daily Driver
I am going to modify them as a temp solution so I can run some air filters until I get an air box.
MikeHynes
True Classic
For the early cars (1300/4spd) the '77 hinges were longer (longest). The later (1500 5spd) had much different hinges.
MikeHynes
True Classic
If you don't mind using the later (1500/5spd) engine cover that swap will give you much more clearance.
I prefer the early cover myself and I don't have an issue with air cleaner clearance on a '74 with dual DCNFs - with a '77 engine cover. The biggest issue I have is finding gauze type filters (K&N) that are as tall as I would like (I'm using OLD Bayless Meaner Cleaners).
Ulix
True Classic
I have a 74 and a 77 engine cover.
While the 77 cover is much taller on the outside, when installed, my measurements claim that there is no more clearance than with the 74 cover.
I know it sounds strange.
I need to redo the measurements at one point and document them with photos.
Itf this were the case, why would they have changed the cover in the first place?
While the 77 cover is much taller on the outside, when installed, my measurements claim that there is no more clearance than with the 74 cover.
I know it sounds strange.
I need to redo the measurements at one point and document them with photos.
Itf this were the case, why would they have changed the cover in the first place?
Dr.Jeff
True Classic
Mike, it's been many years since I've been active in the scene but the off-road VW suppliers used to offer pretty much every size, height, shape, type of replacement filter element for Weber carbs. Maybe check the listings on some of those sites.
MikeHynes
True Classic
It does sound strange. Stranger yet, why did Fiat make the change?I have a 74 and a 77 engine cover.
While the 77 cover is much taller on the outside, when installed, my measurements claim that there is no more clearance than with the 74 cover.
I know it sounds strange.
I need to redo the measurements at one point and document them with photos.
Itf this were the case, why would they have changed the cover in the first place?
BTW - if anyone has a good plastic trim piece that is fitted to the rear of a '77 engine cover (to fill the gap created by raising the engine cover), I would be very interested in buying, or trading, for it. ☺
Chris Obert
autocrosser, X driver
OK, I apologize form the delay. I had not even realized until I was reviewing the forum posts that you had asked this.
Ed Lord, this page shows what I have http://www.fiatplus.com/search.php?...string=4422530&by_fulldescr=Y&by_shortdescr=Y
For all who asked... Or commented.
I have set out on my desk 5 new hinges listed under the 1.3 part number 4245494, and the three I have listed under the 1500 part number 4422530.
This is what I have discovered.
1. The dimensions of BOTH part numbers is exactly the same. All of the lengths and locations of the holes are exactly the same.
2. The difference between them is the 1300 has no stop to prevent the hinge from completely folding around in the "open" direction. The design allows folding over completely the "other way" (closed) on both hinges as impossible. That should be no issue on any installation.
The 1500 has a welded on stop preventing the hinge from folding over in the open position, therefore limiting it's amount to fold over both ways. I will guess that SOCAR and Bertone wanted to limit the 1500 engine lid so it would not be damaged if opened beyond the prop spring's natural limit.
3. My inventory had one hinge miss identified. I actually also have one 1300 used hinge. As I get time I will add it to my web store.
4. The used hinges that Brookie had organized had two 1500 hinges. I have checked those in.
I will say that there is no difference in length of 1.3 or 1.5 engine hinges. They should be completely interchangeable, but if you use 1300 hinges with a 1500 engine lid, you might damage it if opened "too far"!
Do not confuse engine hinges with rear trunk hinges They are different! I will leave that discussion, and sorting thru my extensive inventory, for another day.
Ulix
True Classic
MikeHynes
True Classic
The topic of engine cover hinges seems to come up from time to time. There seems to be some discrepancies about which parts were used. Maybe it's a regional thing? I don't know. I've posted pics in the not too distant past. Here are some pics of the parts I have.
This is a comparison of the '77 hinge (left) next to another early ('74 - 1300/4spd) hinge (right). As you can see...the hinge on the '77 is taller. (I don't know why Fiat made the change, but if you do, I would like to learn about it.)
But because the hinge is raised on a '77, the engine cover itself, and the plastic side grills are also changed to accommodate this raised position.
Here is a pic of the passenger's side plastic grill. It has a plastic riser (circled in red) attached to bring the rubber gasket to the same height as the now raised engine cover (it would look a little funky without this piece - the gasket would droop on both ends).
The sides of the engine cover are also taller on a '77, again to accommodate the raised position of the engine cover - they fit tightly to the plastic side grills. If the sides of the engine cover were not longer, there would be a gap between the bottom of the engine cover and the top inside edge of the plastic grills.
This is a pic of the early engine cover side. It's just over 12mm high.
Here is a pic of the '77 engine cover side. It's about 30.5mm high.
The another thing that's different about the '77 engine cover it it's latch "tang", it's also taller.
Here is a pic of a non-'77 early engine cover latch tang. It's a bit over 34mm tall.
Here a pic of the '77 engine cover latch tang on the right. It's about 79.5mm tall. (The late engine cover is on the left.)
The other thing that's different about a '77 engine cover is the plastic filler strip that's screwed onto the rear, to fill the gap that results when the engine cover is raised (sorry I don't have a good pic, all mine are kinda crappy and I need a good one, anyone have one for sale or trade???)
The engine cover for the later models (1500/5spds) is a completely different animal. While the hinges for the late engine covers are similar to the '77 hinges they are beefed up. Here the late hinge is on the left, a '77 on the right.
The late engine cover has the tallest latch tang, at a bit over 87mm tall. Here are a couple pics, the late cover is on the left. The late engine cover is the "tallest" engine cover, and, it also has a plastic filler strip at the rear.
The late engine cover will fit on an early car if you want to use it. You have to make a couple of adaptor plates to fit the later plastic filler bits that replace the earlier plastic side grills, but they are easy to fab up. It will require a bit more to adapt the late engine cover "prop spring" device to the earlier car (nut-serts will help), or you can just use a stick to hold it open.
I've never attempted to put an early cover on a late car even though I prefer the look of the early cover. I would image that it could be done. (I wonder if the '77 engine cover would clear the FI intake manifold?)
Bottom line. The '77 engine cover is raised, and will give you more clearance to the top of the engine. (At least the '77 engine covers I have.)
But, to use the '77 engine cover without gaps you'll need: the engine cover, the hinges, the plastic side grill add-ons, and...the plastic filler strip at the rear of the engine cover (and you'll have to raise the rubber bumpers a bit too - not sure if those rubber bumpers were longer on the '77 or not?). You can not simply use the '77 hinges - or the late model hinges - without making accommodations for the raised position of the engine cover.
This is a comparison of the '77 hinge (left) next to another early ('74 - 1300/4spd) hinge (right). As you can see...the hinge on the '77 is taller. (I don't know why Fiat made the change, but if you do, I would like to learn about it.)
But because the hinge is raised on a '77, the engine cover itself, and the plastic side grills are also changed to accommodate this raised position.
Here is a pic of the passenger's side plastic grill. It has a plastic riser (circled in red) attached to bring the rubber gasket to the same height as the now raised engine cover (it would look a little funky without this piece - the gasket would droop on both ends).
The sides of the engine cover are also taller on a '77, again to accommodate the raised position of the engine cover - they fit tightly to the plastic side grills. If the sides of the engine cover were not longer, there would be a gap between the bottom of the engine cover and the top inside edge of the plastic grills.
This is a pic of the early engine cover side. It's just over 12mm high.
Here is a pic of the '77 engine cover side. It's about 30.5mm high.
The another thing that's different about the '77 engine cover it it's latch "tang", it's also taller.
Here is a pic of a non-'77 early engine cover latch tang. It's a bit over 34mm tall.
Here a pic of the '77 engine cover latch tang on the right. It's about 79.5mm tall. (The late engine cover is on the left.)
The other thing that's different about a '77 engine cover is the plastic filler strip that's screwed onto the rear, to fill the gap that results when the engine cover is raised (sorry I don't have a good pic, all mine are kinda crappy and I need a good one, anyone have one for sale or trade???)
The engine cover for the later models (1500/5spds) is a completely different animal. While the hinges for the late engine covers are similar to the '77 hinges they are beefed up. Here the late hinge is on the left, a '77 on the right.
The late engine cover has the tallest latch tang, at a bit over 87mm tall. Here are a couple pics, the late cover is on the left. The late engine cover is the "tallest" engine cover, and, it also has a plastic filler strip at the rear.
The late engine cover will fit on an early car if you want to use it. You have to make a couple of adaptor plates to fit the later plastic filler bits that replace the earlier plastic side grills, but they are easy to fab up. It will require a bit more to adapt the late engine cover "prop spring" device to the earlier car (nut-serts will help), or you can just use a stick
to hold it open.I've never attempted to put an early cover on a late car even though I prefer the look of the early cover. I would image that it could be done. (I wonder if the '77 engine cover would clear the FI intake manifold?)
Bottom line. The '77 engine cover is raised, and will give you more clearance to the top of the engine. (At least the '77 engine covers I have.)
But, to use the '77 engine cover without gaps you'll need: the engine cover, the hinges, the plastic side grill add-ons, and...the plastic filler strip at the rear of the engine cover (and you'll have to raise the rubber bumpers a bit too - not sure if those rubber bumpers were longer on the '77 or not?). You can not simply use the '77 hinges - or the late model hinges - without making accommodations for the raised position of the engine cover.
Dr.Jeff
True Classic
Excellent information, thanks a million for sharing it. I've heard about some differences but had no idea there was this much.The topic of engine cover hinges seems to come up from time to time. There seems to be some discrepancies about which parts were used. Maybe it's a regional thing? I don't know. I've posted pics in the not too distant past. Here are some pics of the parts I have.
This is a comparison of the '77 hinge (left) next to another early ('74 - 1300/4spd) hinge (right). As you can see...the hinge on the '77 is taller. (I don't know why Fiat made the change, but if you do, I would like to learn about it.)
View attachment 48830
But because the hinge is raised on a '77, the engine cover itself, and the plastic side grills are also changed to accommodate this raised position.
Here is a pic of the passenger's side plastic grill. It has a plastic riser (circled in red) attached to bring the rubber gasket to the same height as the now raised engine cover (it would look a little funky without this piece - the gasket would droop on both ends).
View attachment 48831
The sides of the engine cover are also taller on a '77, again to accommodate the raised position of the engine cover - they fit tightly to the plastic side grills. If the sides of the engine cover were not longer, there would be a gap between the bottom of the engine cover and the top inside edge of the plastic grills.
This is a pic of the early engine cover side. It's just over 12mm high.
View attachment 48832
Here is a pic of the '77 engine cover side. It's about 30.5mm high.
View attachment 48833
The another thing that's different about the '77 engine cover it it's latch "tang", it's also taller.
Here is a pic of a non-'77 early engine cover latch tang. It's a bit over 34mm tall.
View attachment 48835
Here a pic of the '77 engine cover latch tang on the right. It's about 79.5mm tall. (The late engine cover is on the left.)
View attachment 48836
The other thing that's different about a '77 engine cover is the plastic filler strip that's screwed onto the rear, to fill the gap that results when the engine cover is raised (sorry I don't have a good pic, all mine are kinda crappy and I need a good one, anyone have one for sale or trade???)
The engine cover for the later models (1500/5spds) is a completely different animal. While the hinges for the late engine covers are similar to the '77 hinges they are beefed up. Here the late hinge is on the left, a '77 on the right.
View attachment 48839View attachment 48840
The late engine cover has the tallest latch tang, at a bit over 87mm tall. Here are a couple pics, the late cover is on the left. The late engine cover is the "tallest" engine cover, and, it also has a plastic filler strip at the rear.
View attachment 48841View attachment 48842
The late engine cover will fit on an early car if you want to use it. You have to make a couple of adaptor plates to fit the later plastic filler bits that replace the earlier plastic side grills, but they are easy to fab up. It will require a bit more to adapt the late engine cover "prop spring" device to the earlier car (nut-serts will help), or you can just use a stick
I've never attempted to put an early cover on a late car even though I prefer the look of the early cover. I would image that it could be done. (I wonder if the '77 engine cover would clear the FI intake manifold?)
Bottom line. The '77 engine cover is raised, and will give you more clearance to the top of the engine. (At least the '77 engine covers I have.)
But, to use the '77 engine cover without gaps you'll need: the engine cover, the hinges, the plastic side grill add-ons, and...the plastic filler strip at the rear of the engine cover (and you'll have to raise the rubber bumpers a bit too - not sure if those rubber bumpers were longer on the '77 or not?). You can not simply use the '77 hinges - or the late model hinges - without making accommodations for the raised position of the engine cover.
It might also explain why some people said it was a easy direct swap to put a 'early' engine cover and side panels on a 'late' car - but I found it to be a freaking nightmare.....definitely NOT a direct bolt-on swap as reported. So perhaps some of these differences are why?