Engine mounts!

budgetzagato

budgetzagato

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Got to spend some time in the garage for a while today after other chores were finished. I obtained 3 new motor mount bushings for the Budget Scorpion and finally got to install them today.

Unless the engine is out of the car, you have to replace them one at a time. I first tackled the rear one, the one near the exhaust. It's easy to get out and it obviously was worn out:

IMG_3137.jpg


I used my press and a front wheel bearing race (among other things) to press out the old bushing:

IMG_3139.jpg


Here's old and new side by side:

IMG_3141.jpg


I used the same arrangement more or less to press in the new bushing:

IMG_3142.jpg


The other two bushings were similarly worn out, the front one was pretty much two parts:

IMG_3144.jpg


IMG_3146.jpg


A test drive indicates the engine has changed position rather significantly; I have to adjust the shift linkage as reverse is hard to find.
 
Thanks for the weekly fix. I was beginning to worry...

So are these NOS parts or reproductions? Or is this a current part used on some other Fiat making the OEM? :)

The rubber and plastic bits are the ones I worry most about on my cars as they are very hard to reproduce by other means.

Karl
 
I was beginning to worry too...

As we head into the busy season for builders in the PNW, my spare time is less and less... so I was eager (maybe too much so) to get these installed. The front mount bracket is cast and I broke it, will have to stitch it with my neighbor's MIG welder for good measure.

They are a reproduction part from 034 Motorsport, not sure why they make them. I heard a rumor that this is where The Monte Hospital gets theirs, but the stateside price is much less:
http://www.034motorsport.com/chassi...trans-lancia-scorpion-montecarlo-p-21443.html

They are available in two different rubber densities (durometer), I opted for the softer "street" density, about 25% stiffer than stock.

We'll see how they hold up. I already can feel a difference upon acceleration, so there must have been a lot of engine movement before, it feels a lot smoother, tighter and less snatchy.

I'm trying to get as much basic deferred maintenance done before the big trip in July to the Mirafiori.com Oregon Event/Track Day in Ashland, OR. While I may not (likely will not) get the F.I. conversion done beforehand, it will be a truly roadworthy car by then. :nod:
 
If it's truly cast...

budgetzagato said:
The front mount bracket is cast and I broke it, will have to stitch it with my neighbor's MIG welder for good measure.
Click to expand...

I doubt it will be weldable, at least, not with MIG techniques. Better to look for a replacement, or have a pro weldor who has experience repairing cast iron to have a go at it.

Pete
 
Hmm...

I've welded cast iron manifold/downpipes (think ßeta) without issues. This is simply cracked and should be easy to fix.
 
Can't explain that one Greg...

True cast iron is not easily weldable. Typical techniques involve oxy-actetylene with some type of carbon/iron powder injection at the weld site with some fairly specialized equipment, along with pre-heating to around 4-500 degrees and careful post-heating/cooldown.

If you have gotten good results with MIG-welding, I would suspect the material was forged steel, not cast iron. They can look similar.

Give it a shot though, nothing to lose!

Pete
 
I weld cast iron all the time with my mig on low heat.. another technique is to use a stick welder and nickel rods. either way its done with a series of tack welds, slowly filling in the crack. you can press a tool on the tack to soak the heat out of it and prevent proximity heating. its a slow process but works well.

low quality cast is another story and when that stuff breaks i look for a replacement.
 
Bench Shop Press and Mount Bushing

budgetzagato said:
As we head into the busy season for builders in the PNW, my spare time is less and less... so I was eager (maybe too much so) to get these installed. The front mount bracket is cast and I broke it, will have to stitch it with my neighbor's MIG welder for good measure.
Click to expand...

I know it's been a while since this thread was active, but I have a couple of questions regarding the install of the engine motor mount bushings:

1. How not to break the cast mount when using a press.

2. I'm considering purchasing a cheap press from Harbor Freight and wonder if a 6 ton press with a 2" - 4" working distance would be enough to do the job since I have limited funds. I'm hoping it can do the small jobs like this and bearing pressing, etc.

Thanks.
 
1. If I had to do the cast mount again I'd do the whole one-part-in-the-freezer and one-part-in-the-oven thing to change their dimensions. If that doesn't help, you could also machine some of the outer diameter of the bushing with a belt sander or similar tool. Hard to get it even though.

2. That's the kind I have.
 
Can't get the rear mount bushing out

I successfully removed the passenger's side motor mount off the car and I pressed the old out with the cheap Harbor Freight 4” 6 ton bench press I bought. Pressing the new one in was tricky as it did have a tendency to go in crooked, but slowly I was able to get in installed and back on the car.

The second motor mount was a different story. I decided to go on to the rear (diff mounted) bracket as it looked easy to get to. I got it removed from the car with no problem, but bushing won’t budge in the press. I tried heat with a propane torch I have, but that didn't seem to make a difference and just got the whole part hot. I pressed out the inner rubber material and tried to hack saw away at the bushing's race, but I was afraid I'd ruin the inner mating surface of the bracket.

Any thoughts or advice on a next move?
 
It's tricky like a goat...

It's a tight one. Heat will help, and some sort of penetrant is also helpful.

Since you have the rubber out, go ahead and cut the outer shell out. If you nick the bracket, you can file and sand it smooth again.

A trick I just thought of for installation; cut the outer shell of the new bushing in the same manner, this will allow it to compress and more easily fit into the cast bracket. Since it's not subject to rotational forces, it shouldn't affect the new bushing in use.
 
Thanks Gregory. I ended up taking it to a shop, however, and they pressed the old one out and the new one in for me.

But I decided to tackle the last one myself.....

I'm sorry to keep hijacking your thread on your mount issues, but is there any trick on getting the front mount off the car, clearing it from the bracket on the cross-member? Must I unbolt the cross-member bracket?

I unbolted all the fasteners on the mount itself and tried to carefully jack up the front end of the engine by its oil pan, but when pulling the mount off the engine block studs, it keeps hitting the bracket preventing me from removing it.

Thanks, again.
 
Yes...

If memory serves, I unbolted the bracket from the crossmember also. No other way to do it I found. A bit of a pain but once you resign yourself to doing it it goes ok. I think a ratcheting box-end wrench is handy.
 
budgetzagato said:
1. If I had to do the cast mount again I'd do the whole one-part-in-the-freezer and one-part-in-the-oven thing to change their dimensions. If that doesn't help, you could also machine some of the outer diameter of the bushing with a belt sander or similar tool. Hard to get it even though.
Click to expand...

Well, I went and done it......

Since I couldn't get my cheap Harbor Freight bench press to get the old bushing out, I took it to the local mechanic that performed the work on my rear transaxle mount that I couldn't budge (the the passenger side was the only one I was able to do myself). I thought taking it to a professional rather than have me hacking at it would be the best course of action especially knowing how much trouble others have had with the cast front bracket. Do you think I learned from other people's mistakes?

Well, they pressed the old one out fine, but they broke the cast bracket trying to press the new bushing in. They said they actually got the new bushing in fairly easily, but when they were about to release the pressure on the press, they heard a snap!

:censored:

Now my Scorpion is out of commission until after I get back from my honeymoon and try to scrounge up another bracket or have a good welder have a crack at patching it back up (and to add insult to injury, four days before my wedding, the caterer called and said the open bar will be $1k more than what they originally told me......I hate mondays :wall:).
 
I believe I have a spare Scorpion snail mount...

tjc said:
Well, I went and done it......

Since I couldn't get my cheap Harbor Freight bench press to get the old bushing out, I took it to the local mechanic that performed the work on my rear transaxle mount that I couldn't budge (the the passenger side was the only one I was able to do myself). I thought taking it to a professional rather than have me hacking at it would be the best course of action especially knowing how much trouble others have had with the cast front bracket. Do you think I learned from other people's mistakes?

Well, they pressed the old one out fine, but they broke the cast bracket trying to press the new bushing in. They said they actually got the new bushing in fairly easily, but when they were about to release the pressure on the press, they heard a snap!

:censored:

Now my Scorpion is out of commission until after I get back from my honeymoon and try to scrounge up another bracket or have a good welder have a crack at patching it back up (and to add insult to injury, four days before my wedding, the caterer called and said the open bar will be $1k more than what they originally told me......I hate mondays :wall:).
Click to expand...

I will check if interested. $20 plus actual shipping costs.

Pete
 
Well shoot...

I thought I had one in my parts bin, but it's the triangular mount in the 5th picture at the top of this post, not the snail mount in the first picture. Sorry!

In the next few months I will be removing the engine and mounting system from my Scorpion, if you're not in a huge hurry I can get you the part then.

Pete
 
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