How come..............

There is a lot going on in that engine bay! Not sure what the shock (no pun) cord is doing by the header and coolant tank.
 
When I was in the US Army in the '80s and early '90s, all tactical vehicles that I ever encountered used 24v electrical systems, if not for the entire vehicle then for at least the charging and starting systems. Funny thing, though, all of the batteries were 12v, and 24v was achieved by connecting them in series. In larger vehicles that needed more electrical capacity, four and six batteries were connected in series and in parallel to get the capacity.

One interesting hybrid of 24v and 12v was the class of vehicle called the CUCV, or Commercial Utility Cargo Vehicle. These were General Motors full sized pickups and SUVs that were I guess you could call "ruggedized" for light, non-combat tactical use. They were painted with CARC (Chemical Agent Resistant Coating, aka polyurethane paint) in camo colors, had the manufacturer's heavy duty engine and suspension packages, and were equipped for military requirements such as tow hooks, tow pintle, skid plates, personal weapons storage, antenna mounts, etc. The electrical systems were 12v with the exception of starting, charging, and an add-on circuit used to power military add-on equipment such as radios.
 
I'm not knowledgeable about batteries, perhaps 24v vehicle batteries are common, but I don't think that battery is going to be starting any heavy equipment anytime soon.
I did see a pic of an interesting battery in a vintage 124 rally car.
https://www.vintage-rallye-cars.com...collection-Fiat-124-Abarth-red-yellow-005.jpg
Looks like it could be a 12v & 24v battery, connected as a 24v battery?
Maybe 6v and/or 12v?

That is just a standard 12v battery. Banner batteries are very common here in Germany and often come in a 4 terminal configuration (I used to have one in my X1/9).

The advantage is simply that there are more connection options (depending on the length of the connecting cable) then would be provided with standard 2 terminals that could be inline on one side, inline on the other side or diagonally opposed, depending on the make. This way they cover all the permutations with a single battery.

EDIT: They also give you different terminal shapes:

50200-top.jpg


Cheers,
Dom.
 
According to my 1974 shop manual, there is a place on the X1/9 that uses 24 volts. The procedure to remove the windshield calls for putting two 12 volt batteries in series and connecting them to the two terminals under the center of the windshield. Apparently, there is an embedded heating element around the windshield that you activate by putting 24 volts across it and wait until the adhesive gets hot enough to remove the windshield.

I just took my windshield out. I dug out the wire, and put 24 volts to it with no action. Only then did I think to check the continuity. I must have broken the wire taking it out in wrong place, so no go. I got my glass guy, who got the cutter underneath it and muscled it out.

Paul Davock
 
They also give you different terminal shapes
Dom, those "double-D" shaped posts are interesting. What type of cable clamp is used on them?

The "Banner" batteries kind of remind me of the ones here that have both top and side terminals. And speaking of side terminal batteries, if you think about it that is a vast departure from the traditional type of posts. Do they have them (side post) in Europe? I don't recall ever seeing any on my various visits. I've always thought of it as a American car thing.

Regarding the "Banner" batteries having more configuration options. I think it's a bit weird that there are so many variations of battery post layouts in America. It would seem more efficient to have a couple of basic battery specs, and have all car makers design around them. I know that's a big ask, but not when considering the battery is a consumable item, a rather expensive one, plus an environmental hazard. Can't tell you how many times I needed to replace a battery only to find it isn't kept in stock. If more parts lines were streamlined the cost of maintaining a vehicle would be reduced dramatically. For example, a few years ago Bosch was bought out by a larger conglomerate (or should I say, added under a bigger umbrella). The new parent company decided to reduce the number of individual part numbers by merging lots of items into one "universal" part. The overhead was reduced by an insane amount, making the brand viable again. Imagine if all automotive companies did that. But car makers tend to do the opposite. They want to make everything "proprietary" so you have to buy replacement parts from them. However the aftermarket always copies the parts so it only serves to increase the cost of doing business for all companies involved. Naturally that increased cost is passed on to the consumer.
 
Dom, those "double-D" shaped posts are interesting. What type of cable clamp is used on them?

The "Banner" batteries kind of remind me of the ones here that have both top and side terminals. And speaking of side terminal batteries, if you think about it that is a vast departure from the traditional type of posts. Do they have them (side post) in Europe? I don't recall ever seeing any on my various visits. I've always thought of it as a American car thing.

Regarding the "Banner" batteries having more configuration options. I think it's a bit weird that there are so many variations of battery post layouts in America. It would seem more efficient to have a couple of basic battery specs, and have all car makers design around them. I know that's a big ask, but not when considering the battery is a consumable item, a rather expensive one, plus an environmental hazard. Can't tell you how many times I needed to replace a battery only to find it isn't kept in stock. If more parts lines were streamlined the cost of maintaining a vehicle would be reduced dramatically. For example, a few years ago Bosch was bought out by a larger conglomerate (or should I say, added under a bigger umbrella). The new parent company decided to reduce the number of individual part numbers by merging lots of items into one "universal" part. The overhead was reduced by an insane amount, making the brand viable again. Imagine if all automotive companies did that. But car makers tend to do the opposite. They want to make everything "proprietary" so you have to buy replacement parts from them. However the aftermarket always copies the parts so it only serves to increase the cost of doing business for all companies involved. Naturally that increased cost is passed on to the consumer.

Hi Jeff,

unfortunately, I don't know much about these double-D terminals. I know that the normal clamps will work on them but as to why they have flat sides I'm not sure. I certainly can't find any examples of clamps that are designed for such a terminal. The side post batteries certainly seem to be more of an American thing (although certainly a good idea from a space / packaging perspective).

Reducing the number of product variants is a good idea for both the consumer and the vendor and reduces the overall waste in the industry. I remember one of the first things that Steve Jobs did after retaking the reigns at Apple was to reduce the number of models by about 70%. When I worked for Hewlett-Packard, I remember wondering how we ever made any money with the number of SKUs that we supported.

Cheers,
Dom.
 
Hi Jeff,

unfortunately, I don't know much about these double-D terminals. I know that the normal clamps will work on them but as to why they have flat sides I'm not sure. I certainly can't find any examples of clamps that are designed for such a terminal. The side post batteries certainly seem to be more of an American thing (although certainly a good idea from a space / packaging perspective).

Reducing the number of product variants is a good idea for both the consumer and the vendor and reduces the overall waste in the industry. I remember one of the first things that Steve Jobs did after retaking the reigns at Apple was to reduce the number of models by about 70%. When I worked for Hewlett-Packard, I remember wondering how we ever made any money with the number of SKUs that we supported.

Cheers,
Dom.

Sorry, there is an explanation for the double-D terminals:

https://www.bannerbatterien.com/en/Products/Starter-Batteries/Uni-Bull/19-50-500

Round and Ford terminals, as well as a variable bottom strip with additional adapter, mean that the battery can be used virtually everywhere.

So there you go, Ford must have had their own terminal design at some stage.

Impressive that just by having a more universal design, the one model can support over 900 different types of cars...
 
That is interesting. Another example of auto makers trying to have "proprietary" designs to capitalize on things.

Although I thought they were just another gimmick (I believe GM started this one?), I've come to like the side post style battery. You can use a nice SS button head bolt to anchor the cable with a ring-terminal end. Very clean appearing and much more compact. It also allows you to neatly connect two cables to one post; for example one lead to the fuse box and another to the starter, or one to a chassis ground near the battery and another at the engine bay.
 
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