Performing Honda K24a3/AST5 6spd Conversion

Discussion in 'Workshop Forum' started by lookforjoe, Aug 11, 2019.

  1. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    Mostly worked on the insulation today. Have to use two thicknesses, has to be thinner where the throttle body sits.

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    added thin strips around the opening

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    3/4" insulation on the cover, and edging along the bottom and right side, where I need to hold it.

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    Done (I hope). Have to make a sender cover still.

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    Had to reverse the heater valve, I had the direction of flow flipped. New fuel filter installed.

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    Cut two more harness holes. Forgot to allow for the rear deck wiring.

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    Tomorrow the plan is to start on this mess, get the wiring through to the rear, and layout those that will connect to the engine harness.

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    Last edited: Oct 15, 2019
    quattrorules and bpimm like this.
  2. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    Only had an hour today, so I worked on the AC #8 return line. I spent about an hour or so prior to that trying to straighten out the rear exhaust/driveshaft support bracket on the C30 after I ran over a large section of deer remains on the parkway. Took a while to get all the deer guts off the suspension/axle.

    On the X, I need a hard line to replace the original hard line that went to the low pressure switch on the left frame rail; so I cut two of them up & pieced them back together.

    This is where I'm at

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    This section will need realignment, to move it away from the spare tire hump

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    Line will terminate here (#8 FOR), then attach a barrier hose with #8 MIOR from here up to the compressor return.

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    Last edited: Oct 16, 2019
  3. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    Pouring rain again, so no outside work. Got the AC hard line welded, and then I realized that will be no way to remove it when the subframe is installed, so, I'l cut it into two sections and add another fitting (cut from parts car lines)

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    only other thing I did was to weld the spacers for the charcoal canister.

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  4. Waterbury

    Waterbury True Classic

    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    I enjoy playing the game of "Where is the Starbucks mug??" whenever you upload pictures. It always seems to make an appearance in one or two of them.
     
    lookforjoe likes this.
  5. TonyK

    TonyK True Classic

    Location:
    Grimsby Ont Canada
    Shows where my mind is, I never noticed the mug until now that you mentioned it.

    I don't drink coffee, that is most likely the reason.


    TonyK.

    Grimsby Ontario Canada.
     
  6. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    LOL - I hadn't thought about that, but yes, the first thing I do when I get home is have my coffee. Not starbucks, can't drink that stuff, I just like a very large mug. They had these on sale in England and Wales about 10 years ago.

    What do you do instead of caffeine :D ????

    Had to drop the rear on the Volvo after work to replace the "Leak Detection Pump" - I had a series of related CELs that wouldn't go away & I have to get the car inspected by the end of the month. Hopefully it's not also wiring related. It probably died because I neglected to clean & paint it's support bracket, unlike pretty much every other part on the rear drivetrain :D

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    After that, I cut & refitted the #8 hard pipe. With it in 2 sections, it will work just fine for future servicing with the subframe, etc. in place.

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    Last edited: Oct 18, 2019
    kmead likes this.
  7. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    Little bit done on the wiring.

    cleaned up all the wiring that ran to the back, and routed it all through the tunnel (AC drain tube removed in this pic)

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    EDIT: A few of these inside wires have to be moved to the bay side. I forgot I wanted the switched feeds to connect to the Honda harness, to be routed into the trunk where I will have a relay box.
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    EDIT: TE housing, Yazaki 1., 2.8 series terminals
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    Bay wiring has t be unified & wrapped for final layout
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    The signal wires for gauges, CEL, OBDII will connect to the Honda harness via this 6 pole Deutsch housing

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    WBO2 harness is routed below the bay lid latch.
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    Last edited: Nov 4, 2019
    Austin74 likes this.
  8. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    Only thing I got done today was assembling the hybrid axles. Pouring rain and cold. No process pics, its way to greasy a job. Had to add two belville washers to each Fiat CV, to remove the end float.

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    Last edited: Oct 21, 2019
  9. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    Got the bay wiring routed. Harness to rear lights, etc., switched and constant power for all the Honda ECU/EMS systems. Just have to make another pass through next to the ECU, add the connector & then that aspect is done. Wiring connections to the Honda harness by the intake will be better handled once drivetrain is back in. I'll also do all the ECU & relay wiring after the drivetrain is in.

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  10. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    COld and raining again today, but I needed to get more wiring done. I forgot to add wiring into the cabin for the OBDII related connections, and the fuel pump wiring from the trunk back to the pump, and the vacuum lines into the cabin, and one to the trunk (for my heater valve control solenoid.

    Fuel pump wires - need to add eyelets

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    OBDII wires, switched power, vacuum lines, antenna coaxial

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    wiring to connect to Honda harness, throttle cable & vacuum supply for heater control panel

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    have to add waterproof connectors & housing to reunite this section. Reverse wire (white) is to be removed, that is fed from ECU/EMS harness now. Drilled an additional 1" pass through in the sheet metal between the stock two, and added ground cable from the crossmember ground point into the trunk, for a ground bus.

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    extra pass through for rear harness

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  11. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    Slow going. Got the rear harness connector wired, the fuel pump harness wired from the pump into the rear well, and that's about it :(

    Using housings from a Volvo - uses Sumitomo TS090/187 terminals (2.3 & 4.8mm)

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    Bosch mini-timer for the fuel pump connector

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    Harnesses routed through plate. Added stock ground tree back under my added support bracket

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    Everything tucked out of the way. Hopefully I never need to remove these, since I made them removable :)

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    Have to wire all this for the EMS, after drivetrain is in

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    Should be able to put the drivetrain back in tomorrow, if the weather permits, then I can deal with these wires to the intake side harness.

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    Last edited: Oct 24, 2019
    Mechanogeek likes this.
  12. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    Put the eBrake cables & rod back in, and since it was back in the high 60's, I did the final undercoat on the rear half of the car.

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    after that, I got the drivetrain back in before the light was completely gone

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    clearance in the inner opening is good. I did forget to torque the plenum before I put the motor back in, so I have to do that first thing tomorrow after work so don't forget.

    Put the left cover back on also. Real PITA to get the grommet back in place between the neck & cover.
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    alternator was removed for the install, way too tight to do the install with it in place. I still managed to scratch the paint on the frame rail in that region as it was.
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    Last edited: Oct 28, 2019
    kmead, NEG and nichol01 like this.
  13. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    Had a little time to start attaching crap. Got the alt & starter cables run into the cabin, vacuum lines to intake attached, rad & heater return hoses on, the heater feed done, and torqued the intake plenum - thankfully I had enough room to access the 5 bolts, otherwise I'd be dropping the motor.

    Thankfuly the shift counterweight clears the fuel pump & lines at full travel.
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    Last edited: Oct 26, 2019
    Andy likes this.
  14. darwoodious

    darwoodious Darin Nelson

    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    Great progress and great pix Hussein. Looking forward to your report if expanding the access area was worth the extra effort or not.
     
  15. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    Thank you. So far, just having the improved access to the wiring is a plus for me. Pretty sure I will have good access to the clutch slave bleeder too.

    Forgot that I needed to install the Frost Valve in the cabin, since I have no room for it anywhere in the bay. Need to know where that and the #10 hose is going to lay before I do all the wiring. I bent the bracket mostly flat to match the tunnel contour, and added M6 rivnuts to the tunnel to secure it.

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    New hose will be pretty much this layout:
    also mounted the + buss, also used M6 rivnuts in the frame section to mount it.
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    Cut & added #6 crimp eyelets for the Honda alt & starter cables and the trunk supply.

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    Modified my right side inner panel (made it a few years ago) to take the vacuum reservoir, and a relay box. Cut up a Fiat 500 engine harness bracket for the standoffs, and welded M5 flange nuts to them.

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    Right now, I only need to add my Bay fan & the starter circuit relay in the cabin, just figured it would be cleaner to do this & allow for other circuits, since it's not unusual for me to forget stuff. I was going to just mount the two relays somewhere under the aperture, but decided that would be too messy, hence the decision to install a relay box.

    EDIT - this part is frustrating as I don't seem to be able to come up with a concrete plan for the wiring layout, I just seem to wing it as I go, no matter how much I try to preplan how it's going to go. I now have to extend a number of the wires laying in the well, as I hadn't decided where or what exactly was the plan here. Not sure why I do that. I definitely have an aversion to wiring. I have to double check every connection as I do get dyslexic with this stuff. I guess that's the problem, I really have to do it one wire/circuit at a time, checking them for continuity as I go. Does mean this is gonna take awhile :(

    Relay box will go here:

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    secured the subframe and torque mount, added spacers for the motor mounts so they sit flat. Good clearance for the left rear diff casing now

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    Casing is still close to notch in left frame, but doesn't touch when rocked. More gap than appears in the pic.

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    Last edited: Oct 28, 2019
  16. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    Problems.

    #1
    Can't see anything wrong here, but trans/diff is locked :( So, drivetrain will have to come out again so I can dismantle this & figure out WTF I did wrong here.
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    I didn't take many pics back when I did the LSD install in May. Don't know what I put togther wrong, but it is definitely not right.

    This is one of the only dismantle pics I took, none of the assembly that would show the shift forks, etc :(

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    #2

    Right axle is too short by 2.5". EDIT 11/03/19: Operator error. When I assembled the axles, I installed the right side Honda CV on the shorter one, it just so happens the TSX intermediate is the correct offset to mate with that & provide the proper operation.

    This does mean that for K24/TSX drivetrain swaps, one could retain the stock intermediate shaft/carrier & specify 2 short shafts from MWB.

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    Thankfully I didn't throw out the K24 intermediate axle. I guess the early transaxle has a different casing offset, but I honestly don't see how, as the MWB mount is right there next to it.

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    With that in place, the axle fits OK, joint sits about 1/2 way in the cup

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    At full drop of my coilovers there is still play in the shaft cup, so the axle is not binding

    CV is not touching strut tube, just looks like it.
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    Good news on another front, the slave bleeder is readily accessible with my larger opening

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    Had to elongate the torque mount plate holes to prevent it pushing back on the motor, which was removing what little clearance the slave had off the firewall. I must have welded the plate too high up I guess.

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    I think I'll leave the drivetrain in & finish the rear swaybar, wiring etc., before I drop it again to fix the transaxle issue.

    I'm so frustrated with myself for not checking the diff operation BEFORE putting it all back together, and for then installing it all without still checking it. I had to step away from it & so I cleaned up the garage & mowed the yard for the last time this year.

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    Last edited: Nov 3, 2019
    kmead likes this.
  17. darwoodious

    darwoodious Darin Nelson

    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    That sucks! I remember that getting the shift forks in and aligned correctly was a PITA. I mentioned it here.

    That is strange - the drivers' side would need to be located at the same point and the housing more narrow? I popped down and measured and I see 6" wide at the seals. Your passenger side looks like it is at the same place tho.


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    How long is the K24 intermediate shaft? I got nervous and started looking at photos and the MWB installation guide, but I didn't see anything crazy. Maybe the drivetrain you have has shorter half shafts?
     
  18. Integrale

    Integrale Daily Driver

    Location:
    Davenport, IA
    A little constructive criticism, those bronze plumbing fittings stick out like a sore thumb in an otherwise nice install.
     
  19. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    The K24 shaft is 17.5". I measured the K20 shaft at 15". You shouldn't have an issue, I don't recall Rodger saying anything about his. It has to be the combo I have. The thing is, the diff offset can't be different, or the entire geometry of the transaxle would change.

    I am going to look back at Rodger's for comparison of the offset.

    EDIT: Comparing mine to this pic - Rodger's is set back by comparison (using oil pan flange/bolt as reference marker), but not 2+inches

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    Last edited: Oct 29, 2019
  20. lookforjoe

    lookforjoe True Classic

    Yeah, I struggled with this for awhile. Like this one, I assume you mean?

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    The alternative really comes to AN fittings, which for the required ID (1/2") end up being really bulky and cumbersome. I have a large number of AN swivel fittings that I saved from my high output V70 build, and I didn't like the way any of them lay. The copper pipe is compact & large ID, so I'll live with it, for now anyway :D.
     

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