Sometimes you cannot win

kmead

Old enough to know better
So last night I went out with some friends. While I was out, my middle child who finally attained a level of independence we have been hoping for (he got his drivers license and he now ‘owns’ the 2007 Element I have been driving since last November) calls with “my car won’t turn over and isn’t starting”.

Now this was not entirely unexpected but I was hoping to get through more than just a few days of him driving himself to work and back before a problem cropped up. So my wife who was home went up to assist with a jump, sadly to no avail. So I have them just return home, we will tow the car in the morning.

This morning, my day off as I burn some vacation, I take him to work, go through the pain of dealing with a tow and as I have been anticipating this situation of the Honda K24 eating its starter at 167,000+ miles I actually have one on the proverbial shelf.

There are two approaches to doing this job: dismantle the intake and take out the starter or the ‘fast way’ which is to do it from underneath. I of course want the fast way which leaves as much of what should be untouched as untouched as possible, so I choose the fast way which is done from underneath.

What isn’t obvious is just how little room there actually is to swing a wrench within those confines. I don’t own air tools (something I intend to rectify) so it is all small little arcs to undo what some sadistic Honda engineer specified as M12 fine thread fasteners. After hours of painful work it is back together.

So the next time someone whines about changing an X starter, let me assure you it is a proverbial walk in the park comparatively.

So I hook the battery back up hop in and .... nothing. The exact same behavior. No turn over, no starting and most of all, no happy dance of a job well done. Isht.

So there is a different problem which one hopes is something minor and electrical. However have you ever seen a Honda manual?

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Yeah each one is most of three inches thick.

Fun times, fun times.

I don’t envy you guys with Honda engines in your Xs when it comes time to fix a few things
 
Yuck.

Does the Element have the ELD module? If so, it sits in the battery to starter cable. I think it was in the main fusebox - I cut it out & mounted it up front

IMG-20200112-150101.jpg


From Acura manual....

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Yuck.

Does the Element have the ELD module? If so, it sits in the battery to starter cable. I think it was in the main fusebox - I cut it out & mounted it up front

IMG-20200112-150101.jpg


From Acura manual....

View attachment 36704
Yes it does, it is a Honda after all. In this case I am hoping (given it is an automatic) that it is the starter relay, the transmission range switch or the ignition switch in that order. Or a wiring fault, so I will be wandering through the vagaries of wiring.

When the key is turned to on, all the expected lights turn on, turned to start the lights all continue as expected and just no turn over of the engine/starter. I am presuming this means the ELD is not the issue.

I will start with checking the grounds, then try replacing the relay followed by the wire to the starter solenoid. Then back through the other parts if those check out OK.

Thanks.
 
From the looks of things it was the wire connector to the solenoid, which may have been the base problem in the first place. I also replaced the relay which was easily the most difficult relay I have ever had to remove holy crap!

Anyway all is good but damn that was a crappy job to do. I bought a Milwaukee M12Fuel battery powered rachet, taking it apart and putting it all back together (again) was so much easier. Still painful but much easier.

Winner winner chicken dinner!

Back to independence!
 
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I bought a Milwaukee M12Fuel battery powered rachet
Glad you got it resolved. Being a Fiat enthusiast you are well seasoned at tackling easy jobs that are impossible to do. :p

I'm been thinking about one of those battery (cordless) powered ratchets. Hate to admit it but I'm getting old enough that doing a lot of wrench turning creates arthritic pain afterwards. I have air powered ones but it is a task to set them up (drag out the air hose, etc) and it's not always convenient to get into tight places. Please tell me your thoughts on the cordless one, and any suggestions on specific features you now find important when choosing one.
 
You bought this one? I have had one of these for about 2 years now - it's easily the best cordless I have. I also have the M12 sawsall, driver & angle drill. Easier to keep the same brand & not deal with any more battery setups than I already have

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Actually it was the rachet, I am looking to buy that bad boy torque monster next

I have several of the others as well. Once Sears disappeared i needed a new platform.

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Once Sears disappeared i needed a new platform.
Same here. And about that time someone gave me a cordless Dewalt drill for the holidays. Like @lookforjoe said, "Easier to keep the same brand & not deal with any more battery setups than I already have". So I've been buying all Dewalt cordless tools ever sense. Although from what I hear the Milwaukee stuff is much better.

I have the cordless impact, so I'll have to see what they offer in a ratchet. Any particular features recommended?
 
I bought the higher torque top line model. It offers 55 FP of torque which was competitive with a Dewalt airtool of similar construction. They offer two primary versions and a long neck version which I have never seen in person but is interesting.

I think I will return it and get this version instead:

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The fuel injected engine has been in the 78 for 8 years, just waiting for wiring and plumbing, the Pilot always needs something, but I was referring to this. What every boy needs, a raceX to work on. :)
 
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