Your trivia contest for the day..

[DanielForest]

The Puma and the...... are from the same era. I think the Puma is looking a little bit cleaner. But the ...... could be available with different level of engine performance, the better ones called Gordini offering 105 hp and the handling was really good but the rear engined made the front-end really light at high speed.

 

[Dr.Jeff]

Almost has a bit of the old Renault Alpine look to it. It's not, just reminds me a little of it.

 

[DanielForest]

Jeff, you are not that far. The car in question was kind of an answer to the fact Renault choosed to NOT export the Alpine to North America...

 

[Jefco]

Hmmm... Glad I used to be a Renault guy
https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2017/04/04/not-another-manic-monday-1970-manic-gt-brochure/

 

[kmead]

Well, I’ve got nothing. This one was even too arcane for me and my old reference library of World Cars...

I picked up on the Renault connection immediately, saw the passing similarity to a Puma but it is very different, particularly at the rear.

I give, what is it and what is the history?

 

[kmead]

Ahh now its revealed.

I would take an early Puma over that thing all day. The early Puma’s had a few awkward moments but the Manic’s designer just didn’t know when to put down the pencil.

The early Puma predated the Datsun 240Z and one might argue that it offered up some nicer moments as one looks at the car. The later Pumas are decent cars but not nearly as pretty or well sorted as the early Pumas.

 

[kmead]

thanks for the PM. you are right, I was not right but dang they are close in looks, shape, size, etc.. I had a friend who had the one I was thinking about.

Odie

Were you thinking of the Monocoque Box?

 

[rx1900]

Hey Jefco. Of course you are correct. Well done !! Did you know it from the pics ? Or figured it out from the clues and google ? If you are twisted enough to want one, there is actually one very close to you for sale now......

And Karl...I'm surprised you did not recognize it. Didn't you grow up in Vermont just a couple of hours from the Manic factory ? Yeah....it could have been a bit prettier....but to my eyes it was certainly nicer than the Europa - it's competition at the time.t

But....i was impressed that you seemed to know the Brubaker Box straight away......i figured I had to make the quiz a little tough - A Bricklin or DeTomaso 1600 would have been way too easy....

 

[Dr.Jeff]

I would take an early Puma over that thing all day.

I'm with Karl here. The Puma was a much better style.
If my memory serves me right (which it seldom does anymore), I believe long after the Puma stopped production in Brazil, there was a company in Calif that resurrected it. They altered things to make it more of a kit car for a VW chassis. Overpriced and not nearly as nice as the original.

These cars also remind me of the Glas GT. Being a long time German car fan I owned several of the German Opals. The Glas was similar to the Puma in that the body was fiberglass over a steel frame and used the running gear from a production vehicle, in this case the Opal 1900. I had one back in the late 70's. Despite being a glass body the total weight wasn't much better than the Opal so it was a bit under powered. Suffered from a few stress cracks like any glass body. And being a small production vehicle there were a few other flaws. But excellent style in my opinion:

 

[Jefco]

I'm from central PA, second car I drove was a Dauphine, next was an R10-- the Manic was almost local (as car producers go, at least).

 

[kmead]

My parents first new car was a Dauphine, it is said that the front trunk served as a bathtub for me when I was a baby on several occasions. It replaced a Studebaker. The Renault didn’t last long and was replaced with one of the first Datsuns sold in the US a little green station wagon.

 

[Dr.Jeff]

Karl, sounds like your parents had a fondness for unusual cars for the time. Might have something to do with your choice of vehicles?

 

[kmead]

Next up

 

[Dr.Jeff]

Sort of looks like a Pininfarina badge on the targa bar. And the 3 lug wheels might suggest Renault running gear, or less possibly Citroen or Peugeot. Clearly not a production car, so some sort of design concept exercise.

 

[rx1900]

Hmmm...I dunno.....Cant put a name to it.

As Dr. Jeff says, kinda looks like a Pininfarina badge on there. And the colour scheme screams Italian. But...yes the 3 bolt wheels indicate French running gear origins. To me kind of a mid '70s vibe...

Tough to tell where the engine is. But given the lack of space behind the rear wheels, and lack of any vents back there, i'm thinking it is not rear-engined. And no vents or grills indicating a mid-engine. So I'm thinking it is front wheel drive.

Looks like the fenders, hood/trunk lids, rockers, and bumpers, are all the same front or rear.

Given the lack of side marker lights, and lack of pop-up headlights ( they would be too low to meet regulations - well at least here in North America ), does not appear to be a street legal production car. At least mine were...

So my beat guess is some sort of mid 70's Pininfarina concept car - kinda like a Bertone Runabout - but based on Renault 5

Am i at least close Karl ?

 

[rx1900]

As a very bizarre twist to the Manic GT story....read on....

Back last week when I posted the quiz photo, I searched Google for some pics. I chose the ones i did because they were the only ones I could find that did not reveal the car's identity. All Manics came from the factory with "Manic GT" within the side stripes. Which would have defeated the purpose of the quiz...

The pics i found appeared to be quite old. i'm assuming this car had a repaint in the past. At a time when your local graphics company could not easily reproduce the lettering. As it turns out, there are indications the photos i found were actually from a Kijiji ad here in Ontario a couple of years ago. Note the Ontario license plate. Supposedly with a $35K asking price.

Trolling Craigslist today and guess what I found:
https://montreal.craigslist.org/cto/d/highlands-1971-manic-gt/6828597634.html

An ad posted on Montreal Craigslist Feb 26th, but the car is apparently in Washington state. It's the same Manic in my pics !!! Note the same Ontario license plate..

What are the chances of all that ??

Looks to be in pretty decent original condition. And with the Gordini engine spec. And the rare factory optional Cosmic wheels. If....the ad is real....given the condition and rarity....$15K seems entirely reasonable to me.

Yeah - as The Bangles said - i guess - groan - it is "Just Another Manic Monday"........

 

[kmead]

Hmmm...I dunno.....Cant put a name to it.

As Dr. Jeff says, kinda looks like a Pininfarina badge on there. And the colour scheme screams Italian. But...yes the 3 bolt wheels indicate French running gear origins. To me kind of a mid '70s vibe...

Tough to tell where the engine is. But given the lack of space behind the rear wheels, and lack of any vents back there, i'm thinking it is not rear-engined. And no vents or grills indicating a mid-engine. So I'm thinking it is front wheel drive.

Looks like the fenders, hood/trunk lids, rockers, and bumpers, are all the same front or rear.

Given the lack of side marker lights, and lack of pop-up headlights ( they would be too low to meet regulations - well at least here in North America ), does not appear to be a street legal production car. At least mine were...

So my beat guess is some sort of mid 70's Pininfarina concept car - kinda like a Bertone Runabout - but based on Renault 5

Am i at least close Karl ?

Pretty much right on all counts aside from the basis the car was built on.

Let me know when you get to “uncle”

I will do better on the production car aspect next time around. My apologies, I never follow directions well...

 

[rx1900]

Hmmm....although I think Smart cars also have 3 bolt wheels, I think the eras are too different for that as a basis....

Most of the little Italian stuff of the era did not have 3 bolt wheels. Alfasuds i think were 4 on 98mm, The little Fiats like 500 and 600 had a really wide 4 bolt pattern.

If not the R5...then I think some other little French cars back then also had 3 bolt wheels. I think most Simca's were 4 bolt. But i think some early Citroen Visa ( I think later ones went to 4 bolt ) or maybe Peugeot 104 also had 3 bolt wheels for a while. Come to think of it...back then Peugeot did have a relationship with Pininfarina - I think they designed the 504 Coupe of the same era - so I'll venture it is a Pininfarina 104 based concept car produced for the Paris Auto Salon in...say 1973ish...and called the.....Peugafarina....

so yeah.......I call "uncle"

But.....just to annoy you further Karl.....speaking of odd wheel bolt patterns....see if you recognize these wheels. I made it real easy for you as they are sitting in front of the car they belong to.

 

[kmead]

Hmmm....although I think Smart cars also have 3 bolt wheels, I think the eras are too different for that as a basis....

Most of the little Italian stuff of the era did not have 3 bolt wheels. Alfasuds i think were 4 on 98mm, The little Fiats like 500 and 600 had a really wide 4 bolt pattern.

If not the R5...then I think some other little French cars back then also had 3 bolt wheels. I think most Simca's were 4 bolt. But i think some early Citroen Visa ( I think later ones went to 4 bolt ) or maybe Peugeot 104 also had 3 bolt wheels for a while. Come to think of it...back then Peugeot did have a relationship with Pininfarina - I think they designed the 504 Coupe of the same era - so I'll venture it is a Pininfarina 104 based concept car produced for the Paris Auto Salon in...say 1973ish...and called the.....Peugafarina....

so yeah.......I call "uncle"

But.....just to annoy you further Karl.....speaking of odd wheel bolt patterns....see if you recognize these wheels. I made it real easy for you as they are sitting in front of the car they belong to.

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So you and Tom Ginefra arrived at the same place at nearly the same time. You are the more explicitly correct. Nice job both of you.

It is the Peugeot 104 Peugette. It was a concept sports car based on the new 104 using the same body panels for each door, for the front and rear decks with the same bumper front and rear to keep the tooling cost and vehicle cost low for a low volume vehicle.

This was one of the earliest examples of product design applied to an automobile that I am aware of, most cars to this point were clearly styled rather than conceptualized as a series of rationalized parts. It is one of the things that got me into design back in the day. It is from 1976 and was intended as a personal sports car based on simple mechanicals that could also have a racing series using the exact same vehicle with a simple monoposto addition to the cockpit.

In some ways this is the rat rod of sporting cars that Carl seems to be yearning for.

 

[kmead]

Tricky. I have seen those rims and it will come to me. The early Dauphin and Renault 4CV used a rim like that but with 5 lugs at the periphery of the drum brake. VW used a large diameter bolt circle on the early cars but not that big and they were always 15s versus the 13” rims depicted there. I don’t have it yet but I will churn on this a bit. Thanks