<TABLE cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD colSpan=2><TABLE width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-TOP: 4px" vAlign=top colSpan=2>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Computer Dyno Results<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000 at 3:31 PM[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Ulix [/FONT]</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=bottom colSpan=3><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD colSpan=3>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->These are dyno graphs of Steve Ambrose's stock FI X1/9 and my modified 1300 '74.
The graphs were made with Steve's "Road Dyno", a box that connects to a plug wire like a timing light and records rpm vs. time. Later, one downloads this data into a PC, enters parameters such as weight, gear ratios, tire size, aerodynamcs and weather data, and the software calculates hp (flywheel) and torque figures from this.
After Steve had reported that the software returned almost exactly the values published by Fiat for his car and that he was getting repeatable results, I wanted to try it on my car.
Here is the graph. My curves don't start until 2800rpm because that was the only run that we managed to convert into Excel format.
Note that from 3000 rpm on, my curves are real data, i.e., there is almost no torque below 3000 rpm. The 1500 FI torque curve is just amazingly flat.
The two hp curve are pretty close from 4000 to 5000, but then I keep going
The curve is fairly linear from 5000 to 7000, but not too peaky since the hp stays between 90 and 95 from 6300 to 8000. I am surprised that at 8500 rpm, I still have 86 hp.
All in all, I can't complain about the upper end, since the cam is a mild PBS S-2 which they list with a seat-to-seat duration of only 27-71/71-27.
Other specs are: 1300cc, Yugo head with PBS big valve treatment, S-2 cam, 2x40DCNF with 30mm venturis, PBS header with 2" exhaust, Plex ignition (34 degrees at 4000rpm).
The bottom end is a little disappointing in everyday driving. This is confirmed in the runs we started at 1500rpm. I have about the same torque at 2000rpm and 3000rpm, but inbetween, there is a big dip. While this could be caused by me opening the throttle fully too early, it illustrates that the car is harder to drive in traffic. Floor it too soon and it "falls on its face". I will scan in the other plots.
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Author[/FONT]</TD><TD>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Reply[/FONT]</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "u";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "m";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "b";n54_em = n54_em + "l";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "t"; document.write("Mike"); // --> </SCRIPT>Mike <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Road dyno<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 5:29 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Is this Road dyno available or is it homebuilt?
Cheers
Mike<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Ulix[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Look here<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 3:34 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->http://www.charm.net/~mchaney/homedyno/dynokit.htm
Ulix<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "j";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "f";n54_em = n54_em + "f";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "b";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "r";n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "x";n54_em = n54_em + "1";n54_em = n54_em + "9";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "m"; document.write("Jeff Zucker"); // --> </SCRIPT>Jeff Zucker <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Similar driving experience<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 5:35 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Ulix, I have similar low-end driving experience. If I open the throttle full at low rpms, the car will loose power and "miss" for a couple of seconds. At 3500 rpm, the S-2 cam kicks in and delivers lots of power. This appears to be consistant in all gears; I can summon up good passing power in 5th gear at 80 mph on the freeway. I wish I knew someone down in LA who could Dyno my car (anybody know anyone down here?); I guess I can pay for this service! I would be very interested in seeing how it compares to your setup. - Jeff
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "u";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "m";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "b";n54_em = n54_em + "l";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "t"; document.write("Mike"); // --> </SCRIPT>Mike <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Uuuummm<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 5:36 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Looking at the graph more carfully, with an interest since I have a 1500 FI it seems to me the 1500FI Could benifit from improvement in the 5000RPM and above area. Since it seems better (at least on Paper) than a modified 1300 below that range.
I'll have to think now about the best way to do this.
Mike
"the more answers I find the more questions I have"
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "v";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "h";n54_em = n54_em + "h";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "h";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "w";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "y";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "t"; document.write("Steve Hoelscher"); // --> </SCRIPT>Steve Hoelscher <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Dyno runs<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 8:48 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Yes the 1500 FI car is better below 5000 rpm than a modified 1300. But lets look at what we are comparing before we jump to conclusions. Note that the 1300 has big carbs, big valves and big cam. These three mods will move the power band up the rpm range as they are all intended to move a larger volume of air. The larger diameter of the intake track, while increasing total volume at high rpm (and thus improving peak HP), will reduce port velocity, especially at lower rpm, which will kill torque.
The 1500 FI car is all about making torque. Long narrow intake runners and a large intake plenum, FI (instead of carbs), standard size valves, stock cam (short duration) and lets not forget the 1500 cc motor has a longer stroke. The less oversquare motor means more time for the flame front to propogate. All factors that would improve torque over the 1300. All factors that would also limit high rpm performance.
So, to improve the high rpm performance of the 1500 would require some of the mods Ulix had done to his 1300. The result would be to trade off some of the 1500 FI's low end power.
I have probably made as many X1/9 dyno pulls as anyone and am probably the only person to ever have an injected 1300 on a dyno. Fact number one: the 1300 will never make the torque of the 1500. Never. Proof of the old saying "there is no substitute for cubic inches", or at least in this case "stoke". My injected 1300 made about as much horsepower as my injected 1500, but almost 20 percent less torque. It also made its peak horsepower and torque numbers almost 1000 rpm higher. Both motors used stock cams, valves and ports (with the exception of port matching).
My 1500 car makes peak torque at 4250 rpm, almost exactly the same rpm as the stock motor's torque peak, only mine makes A LOT more torque. Peak horsepower too is at almost the exact location as the stock power peak. This is due mainly to the use of the stock camshaft. Fact number two: The 1500 will never make significantly more peak horsepower, or more power above 5000 rpm, with the stock camshaft.
Conclusions: If you want your 1300 to be faster, you must move more air and that means a peaky motor. My '74 1300 dynos almost exactly like Ulix's. 90 HP at 7000 rpm and nothing below 5000. If you want your 1500 FI car to be faster, work on torque and that means port velocity. Yes you can spin the motor faster and use the same big carbs, valves and cam as the 1300, but you will be trading away the best feature of the FI 1500 motor.
Steve
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "j";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "f";n54_em = n54_em + "f";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "b";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "r";n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "x";n54_em = n54_em + "1";n54_em = n54_em + "9";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "m"; document.write("Jeff Zucker"); // --> </SCRIPT>Jeff Zucker <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Can't talk for Ulix...<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 9:15 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->but my 1600cc with all of Ulix's engine upgrades blows a stock 1500 FI away sooooo bad I can't even compare them. While only 100cc shouldn't make that much difference, the blowen out version is at least 25% faster (and may be MUCH faster; I'm reluctant to push the limits on such a young engine). It can't compare to my old '84 Carrera, but I would never expect it to. While the 1600cc isn't destined to be a daily driver, it's a blast to run around town, annoying the neighbors!
- Jeff<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Ulix[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->But I'll talk for Jeff
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 1:20 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Jeff,
you said yourself that you are having torque problems below 3000. Check out the torque curve of the FI car, it almost has as much torque at 1500 as at 3000. I guess that is what Steve is talking about.
I wish I could drive your car though to see what just a much bigger bottom end would do.
Ulix<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "j";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "f";n54_em = n54_em + "f";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "b";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "r";n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "x";n54_em = n54_em + "1";n54_em = n54_em + "9";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "m"; document.write("Jeff Zucker"); // --> </SCRIPT>Jeff Zucker <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->I'm not sure it's torque problems.....<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 7:55 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->it may be carb adjustments contributing to the power loss at low rpm. The motor only has a few miles on it and it seems to be running rich (fuel smell in the exhaust). I'll have it re-adjusted and see if I experience the same "missing" at low rpms. Keep you posted! - Jeff<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "u";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "m";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "b";n54_em = n54_em + "l";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "t"; document.write("Mike"); // --> </SCRIPT>Mike <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->What to do<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 8:51 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Ok so the obvious thing would be larger intake valves, ported head and a better cam, What about the fuel injection? have you do some tests? Have you dynoed different cam with the 1500 FI? Any recomendation?
So far I plan on using Vickautosport 9.2 CR pistons unless you can sugess a better alternative
I do want to retain the FI, after all that's why i bought this '81.how much experimenting have you done with this system?
Thanks
Mike<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "v";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "h";n54_em = n54_em + "h";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "h";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "w";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "y";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "t"; document.write("Steve Hoelscher"); // --> </SCRIPT>Steve Hoelscher <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->What to do?<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 7:57 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Before you start building on your motor, you should have an idea of what you want as a finished product, then develope a plan of action for the motor that will get you there.
I build a very sweet 1500 using a bump in compression, a mild port job, European cam, 40 DCNFs and an IAP header. Everything was carefully balanced and blueprinted. This motor was amazing. It pulled very hard from 2500 rpm to 7500 rpm with no flat spots, was completely streetable and excelled on the track.
No, I haven't dyno'd any other cams. Most of my dyno work has been on my racecar motors which precludes any change in cam, valves or ports. If you are using the stock FI, don't go too wild with the cam. A PBS SX-1 works well with the stock FI system.
In my opinion, most people go about building an engine the wrong way. They don't look at the entire engine as a system. Instead, they either over cam or over port the motor and end up with less than the sum of its parts. I prefer to match the componets more carefully, if not more conservatively and spend more time on tuning the finished product. This will result in a much more crisp running engine with more usefull power.
Steve
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]scot[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->built 1500 FI<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 8:58 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->I just got my car running with a setup like yous, but with FI and no header. Any suggestions on fine tuning?<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "b";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "h";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "m";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "l";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "m"; document.write("bob"); // --> </SCRIPT>bob <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->three bumps of compression<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 10:29 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->See, now if Mac had said bump the compression, it would mean go from 9.5:1 to 10.5:1,,,if Ulix had said it, then it would mean go to 11.5:1,,,but when Steve H. says it, does that mean 17:1? Guess I need to find some unit of measure when I weigh Steve's words.
I still remember Steve explaining how to create stiff springs--and ending by saying that his softest was much more firm than this.
Now a "mild port job" probably is just that, judging from the previous post.
But a European cam,,,hmmm, er, well,,,,hmmmmm?<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Bob[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Will stock FI work with mods?<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 12 2000, 6:21 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->I've heard that the stock Bosch FI will not work with motor mods, it can't react to increased flow!
Is this true??
Bob<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "L";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "l";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "f";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "m";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "r";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "m"; document.write("Lalo"); // --> </SCRIPT>Lalo <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 90px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Not true<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 12 2000, 12:25 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 90px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->I can point to at least 4 BOSCH FI X1/9s, mine included, that have BV heads, higher compression and hotter cams that will keep up with most dual carb cars out there. With very minor tweeks the BOSCH FI system responds well to modifications. Steve's warnings about keeping the cam warm and not hot are right on the money. Rockwell measured power LOSSES on the dyno with most aftermarket performance cams. But on the other hand, I there's a member of Fiat America that has his FI car working very well with a 300 degree cam. Once again agreeing with Steve, you need to consider the engine as a system from the beginning and not just start adding performance parts hoping that the end result will be a good one.
-Lalo
VP FIAT America
'74 X1/9
http://www.netcom.com/~la_migra<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Bob D[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 105px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->RE: FI<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 13 2000, 7:41 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 105px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Thanks for the feedback, as a first-time X1/9 (1985)owner I am trying to gather as much info as I can to begin my resto/rebuild. I find these cars a blast to drive and hope to someday put some real muscle into it. I've only had my car about a month and recently replaced the rear struts and mounts, the right-rear was blown out, what a super handling car. I will be looking for some info on FI mods down the road, I checked out your web-site....pretty cool.
Bob<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]scot[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 90px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->FI & MODS<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 16 2000, 9:18 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 90px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->ported , custom exhaust, 10:1 compresion, mild cam, seems to work ok on my FI 1500. of course, I still want more power.Turbo next?<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "d";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "v";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "d";n54_em = n54_em + "_";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "u";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "h";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "m";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "l";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "m"; document.write("David Ius"); // --> </SCRIPT>David Ius <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 105px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Similar to my plans.<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 17 2000, 12:05 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 105px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Your mods are similar to what I am planning. Compression may be a touch high for Australian PULP - I was thinking more like 9.5:1. What camshaft did you choose? Did you need to alter the spring tension in the AFM or play with the fuel pressure? Have you done any dyno work?
I suggest that you don't drive a turbo. I hate the bloody things but fell in LOVE with that never ending shove in the back! Now I'm going to spend lots of money getting that performance in other ways
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]scot[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 120px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Mod FI<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 20 2000, 7:32 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 120px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->cam is IAP performance(mild street) no changes to FI other than polishing all internal surfaces, allso polished manifold ext.(Looks really nice) no dyno work,but car pulls well from 2K in 4th comes on hard at 3500,still pulling well at 7500.<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000 at 3:31 PM[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Ulix [/FONT]</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=bottom colSpan=3><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD colSpan=3>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->These are dyno graphs of Steve Ambrose's stock FI X1/9 and my modified 1300 '74.
The graphs were made with Steve's "Road Dyno", a box that connects to a plug wire like a timing light and records rpm vs. time. Later, one downloads this data into a PC, enters parameters such as weight, gear ratios, tire size, aerodynamcs and weather data, and the software calculates hp (flywheel) and torque figures from this.
After Steve had reported that the software returned almost exactly the values published by Fiat for his car and that he was getting repeatable results, I wanted to try it on my car.
Here is the graph. My curves don't start until 2800rpm because that was the only run that we managed to convert into Excel format.
Note that from 3000 rpm on, my curves are real data, i.e., there is almost no torque below 3000 rpm. The 1500 FI torque curve is just amazingly flat.
The two hp curve are pretty close from 4000 to 5000, but then I keep going
All in all, I can't complain about the upper end, since the cam is a mild PBS S-2 which they list with a seat-to-seat duration of only 27-71/71-27.
Other specs are: 1300cc, Yugo head with PBS big valve treatment, S-2 cam, 2x40DCNF with 30mm venturis, PBS header with 2" exhaust, Plex ignition (34 degrees at 4000rpm).
The bottom end is a little disappointing in everyday driving. This is confirmed in the runs we started at 1500rpm. I have about the same torque at 2000rpm and 3000rpm, but inbetween, there is a big dip. While this could be caused by me opening the throttle fully too early, it illustrates that the car is harder to drive in traffic. Floor it too soon and it "falls on its face". I will scan in the other plots.
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Road dyno<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 5:29 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Is this Road dyno available or is it homebuilt?
Cheers
Mike<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Look here<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 3:34 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->http://www.charm.net/~mchaney/homedyno/dynokit.htm
Ulix<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Similar driving experience<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 5:35 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Ulix, I have similar low-end driving experience. If I open the throttle full at low rpms, the car will loose power and "miss" for a couple of seconds. At 3500 rpm, the S-2 cam kicks in and delivers lots of power. This appears to be consistant in all gears; I can summon up good passing power in 5th gear at 80 mph on the freeway. I wish I knew someone down in LA who could Dyno my car (anybody know anyone down here?); I guess I can pay for this service! I would be very interested in seeing how it compares to your setup. - Jeff
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Uuuummm<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 5:36 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Looking at the graph more carfully, with an interest since I have a 1500 FI it seems to me the 1500FI Could benifit from improvement in the 5000RPM and above area. Since it seems better (at least on Paper) than a modified 1300 below that range.
I'll have to think now about the best way to do this.
Mike
"the more answers I find the more questions I have"
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Dyno runs<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 8:48 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Yes the 1500 FI car is better below 5000 rpm than a modified 1300. But lets look at what we are comparing before we jump to conclusions. Note that the 1300 has big carbs, big valves and big cam. These three mods will move the power band up the rpm range as they are all intended to move a larger volume of air. The larger diameter of the intake track, while increasing total volume at high rpm (and thus improving peak HP), will reduce port velocity, especially at lower rpm, which will kill torque.
The 1500 FI car is all about making torque. Long narrow intake runners and a large intake plenum, FI (instead of carbs), standard size valves, stock cam (short duration) and lets not forget the 1500 cc motor has a longer stroke. The less oversquare motor means more time for the flame front to propogate. All factors that would improve torque over the 1300. All factors that would also limit high rpm performance.
So, to improve the high rpm performance of the 1500 would require some of the mods Ulix had done to his 1300. The result would be to trade off some of the 1500 FI's low end power.
I have probably made as many X1/9 dyno pulls as anyone and am probably the only person to ever have an injected 1300 on a dyno. Fact number one: the 1300 will never make the torque of the 1500. Never. Proof of the old saying "there is no substitute for cubic inches", or at least in this case "stoke". My injected 1300 made about as much horsepower as my injected 1500, but almost 20 percent less torque. It also made its peak horsepower and torque numbers almost 1000 rpm higher. Both motors used stock cams, valves and ports (with the exception of port matching).
My 1500 car makes peak torque at 4250 rpm, almost exactly the same rpm as the stock motor's torque peak, only mine makes A LOT more torque. Peak horsepower too is at almost the exact location as the stock power peak. This is due mainly to the use of the stock camshaft. Fact number two: The 1500 will never make significantly more peak horsepower, or more power above 5000 rpm, with the stock camshaft.
Conclusions: If you want your 1300 to be faster, you must move more air and that means a peaky motor. My '74 1300 dynos almost exactly like Ulix's. 90 HP at 7000 rpm and nothing below 5000. If you want your 1500 FI car to be faster, work on torque and that means port velocity. Yes you can spin the motor faster and use the same big carbs, valves and cam as the 1300, but you will be trading away the best feature of the FI 1500 motor.
Steve
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Can't talk for Ulix...<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 9:15 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->but my 1600cc with all of Ulix's engine upgrades blows a stock 1500 FI away sooooo bad I can't even compare them. While only 100cc shouldn't make that much difference, the blowen out version is at least 25% faster (and may be MUCH faster; I'm reluctant to push the limits on such a young engine). It can't compare to my old '84 Carrera, but I would never expect it to. While the 1600cc isn't destined to be a daily driver, it's a blast to run around town, annoying the neighbors!
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->But I'll talk for Jeff
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 1:20 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Jeff,
you said yourself that you are having torque problems below 3000. Check out the torque curve of the FI car, it almost has as much torque at 1500 as at 3000. I guess that is what Steve is talking about.
I wish I could drive your car though to see what just a much bigger bottom end would do.
Ulix<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->I'm not sure it's torque problems.....<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 7:55 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->it may be carb adjustments contributing to the power loss at low rpm. The motor only has a few miles on it and it seems to be running rich (fuel smell in the exhaust). I'll have it re-adjusted and see if I experience the same "missing" at low rpms. Keep you posted! - Jeff<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->What to do<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 8:51 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Ok so the obvious thing would be larger intake valves, ported head and a better cam, What about the fuel injection? have you do some tests? Have you dynoed different cam with the 1500 FI? Any recomendation?
So far I plan on using Vickautosport 9.2 CR pistons unless you can sugess a better alternative
I do want to retain the FI, after all that's why i bought this '81.how much experimenting have you done with this system?
Thanks
Mike<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->What to do?<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 7:57 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Before you start building on your motor, you should have an idea of what you want as a finished product, then develope a plan of action for the motor that will get you there.
I build a very sweet 1500 using a bump in compression, a mild port job, European cam, 40 DCNFs and an IAP header. Everything was carefully balanced and blueprinted. This motor was amazing. It pulled very hard from 2500 rpm to 7500 rpm with no flat spots, was completely streetable and excelled on the track.
No, I haven't dyno'd any other cams. Most of my dyno work has been on my racecar motors which precludes any change in cam, valves or ports. If you are using the stock FI, don't go too wild with the cam. A PBS SX-1 works well with the stock FI system.
In my opinion, most people go about building an engine the wrong way. They don't look at the entire engine as a system. Instead, they either over cam or over port the motor and end up with less than the sum of its parts. I prefer to match the componets more carefully, if not more conservatively and spend more time on tuning the finished product. This will result in a much more crisp running engine with more usefull power.
Steve
<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->built 1500 FI<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 8:58 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->I just got my car running with a setup like yous, but with FI and no header. Any suggestions on fine tuning?<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->three bumps of compression<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 10:29 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->See, now if Mac had said bump the compression, it would mean go from 9.5:1 to 10.5:1,,,if Ulix had said it, then it would mean go to 11.5:1,,,but when Steve H. says it, does that mean 17:1? Guess I need to find some unit of measure when I weigh Steve's words.
I still remember Steve explaining how to create stiff springs--and ending by saying that his softest was much more firm than this.
Now a "mild port job" probably is just that, judging from the previous post.
But a European cam,,,hmmm, er, well,,,,hmmmmm?<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Will stock FI work with mods?<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 12 2000, 6:21 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->I've heard that the stock Bosch FI will not work with motor mods, it can't react to increased flow!
Is this true??
Bob<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 90px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Not true<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 12 2000, 12:25 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 90px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->I can point to at least 4 BOSCH FI X1/9s, mine included, that have BV heads, higher compression and hotter cams that will keep up with most dual carb cars out there. With very minor tweeks the BOSCH FI system responds well to modifications. Steve's warnings about keeping the cam warm and not hot are right on the money. Rockwell measured power LOSSES on the dyno with most aftermarket performance cams. But on the other hand, I there's a member of Fiat America that has his FI car working very well with a 300 degree cam. Once again agreeing with Steve, you need to consider the engine as a system from the beginning and not just start adding performance parts hoping that the end result will be a good one.
-Lalo
VP FIAT America
'74 X1/9
http://www.netcom.com/~la_migra<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 105px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->RE: FI<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 13 2000, 7:41 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 105px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Thanks for the feedback, as a first-time X1/9 (1985)owner I am trying to gather as much info as I can to begin my resto/rebuild. I find these cars a blast to drive and hope to someday put some real muscle into it. I've only had my car about a month and recently replaced the rear struts and mounts, the right-rear was blown out, what a super handling car. I will be looking for some info on FI mods down the road, I checked out your web-site....pretty cool.
Bob<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 90px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->FI & MODS<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 16 2000, 9:18 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 90px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->ported , custom exhaust, 10:1 compresion, mild cam, seems to work ok on my FI 1500. of course, I still want more power.Turbo next?<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 105px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Similar to my plans.<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 17 2000, 12:05 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 105px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Your mods are similar to what I am planning. Compression may be a touch high for Australian PULP - I was thinking more like 9.5:1. What camshaft did you choose? Did you need to alter the spring tension in the AFM or play with the fuel pressure? Have you done any dyno work?
I suggest that you don't drive a turbo. I hate the bloody things but fell in LOVE with that never ending shove in the back! Now I'm going to spend lots of money getting that performance in other ways
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 120px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Mod FI<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 20 2000, 7:32 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 120px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->cam is IAP performance(mild street) no changes to FI other than polishing all internal surfaces, allso polished manifold ext.(Looks really nice) no dyno work,but car pulls well from 2K in 4th comes on hard at 3500,still pulling well at 7500.<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]