<TABLE cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD colSpan=2><TABLE width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-TOP: 4px" vAlign=top colSpan=2>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Engine Rebuild<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]August 28 2000 at 10:20 PM[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "d";n54_em = n54_em + "r";n54_em = n54_em + "m";n54_em = n54_em + "1";n54_em = n54_em + "1";n54_em = n54_em + "7";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "m"; document.write("Eric Armstrong"); // --> </SCRIPT>Eric Armstrong <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT> [/FONT]</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=bottom colSpan=3><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD colSpan=3>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Well, as some of you remember, when I took my block down to be honed, the machine shop said that it was a 86mm bore and not a 86.4 bore, which is the standard size for a 1500cc engine. The engine has stamped on it 138.1 instead of the 125.X number.
WELL, guess what? It turns out that the 138.1 is actually a 1300cc block and a 138.2 is a 1500 block. The thing that has really thrown me is the pistons, which are from a 1500cc engine, ie deep piston relief. The only thing I can figure is that someone put 1500cc pistons in a 1300cc engine.
I am calling Vicks tomorrow to see if they have ever heard of this. It also turns out that the stamp on the block says it is a 128.A1.040, which is not in any of the books. Lucky me. And yes, I should have looked at that stamping instead of the one on the side of the block. Dooh.
Now, what should I do, bore the pistons .4mm or order smaller rings and be happy with it?
Thought that some of you might find this interesting.
Good night.
Eric Armstrong<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Author[/FONT]</TD><TD>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Reply[/FONT]</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "L";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "l";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "f";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "m";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "r";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "m"; document.write("Lalo"); // --> </SCRIPT>Lalo <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Not necessarily...<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]August 29 2000, 7:01 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->"WELL, guess what? It turns out that the 138.1 is actually a 1300cc block and a 138.2 is a 1500 block. The thing that has really thrown me is the pistons, which are from a 1500cc engine, ie deep piston relief. The only thing I can figure is that someone put 1500cc pistons in a 1300cc engine. "
You are correct about the block, but not about the pistons. The deep cast-in reliefs are also in the 1300 pistons, so that is not an indicator that they are from a 1500, especially is your bore is 86mm.
As for re-using the pistons, be sure to carefully inspect them to make sure they still meet spec before deciding to use them. Also, make sure the pistons/bore relationship is still within spec before re-using them.
-Lalo<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "r";n54_em = n54_em + "v";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "i";n54_em = n54_em + "m";n54_em = n54_em + "p";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "r";n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "u";n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "t";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "h"; document.write("steve ambrose"); // --> </SCRIPT>steve ambrose <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->So it's a late 1300....<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]August 29 2000, 8:30 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Hi Eric... I was expecting this. From your earlier e-mail, I was afraid your "1500" was really a late 1300. I have seen many '78 1300's with deep valve reliefs in the 86.0 pistons.
I know you were undertaking this project as rebuilding a 1500. The major difference between a 1300 and a 1500 is the stroke. (of course the block height and rod length and material are different too)
So if you want a 1500, you will have to go find one, or you can continue and rebuild the 1300.
Good luck,
Steve<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "h";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "l";n54_em = n54_em + "z";n54_em = n54_em + "m";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "h";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + "u";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "e";n54_em = n54_em + "d";n54_em = n54_em + "u"; document.write("Mark Scholz"); // --> </SCRIPT>Mark Scholz <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Getting a head start on the Rally?<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]August 30 2000, 12:20 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->So Eric, do you now have a rebuild candidate for the Rally? Or the 3p?
Time to haul out another 1500 to rebuild from under the workbench.<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
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[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]August 28 2000 at 10:20 PM[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript> <!-- var n54_em; n54_em = ""; n54_em = n54_em + "a";n54_em = n54_em + "n";n54_em = n54_em + "d";n54_em = n54_em + "r";n54_em = n54_em + "m";n54_em = n54_em + "1";n54_em = n54_em + "1";n54_em = n54_em + "7";n54_em = n54_em + "@";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "s";n54_em = n54_em + ".";n54_em = n54_em + "c";n54_em = n54_em + "o";n54_em = n54_em + "m"; document.write("Eric Armstrong"); // --> </SCRIPT>Eric Armstrong <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT> [/FONT]</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=bottom colSpan=3><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD colSpan=3>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Well, as some of you remember, when I took my block down to be honed, the machine shop said that it was a 86mm bore and not a 86.4 bore, which is the standard size for a 1500cc engine. The engine has stamped on it 138.1 instead of the 125.X number.
WELL, guess what? It turns out that the 138.1 is actually a 1300cc block and a 138.2 is a 1500 block. The thing that has really thrown me is the pistons, which are from a 1500cc engine, ie deep piston relief. The only thing I can figure is that someone put 1500cc pistons in a 1300cc engine.
I am calling Vicks tomorrow to see if they have ever heard of this. It also turns out that the stamp on the block says it is a 128.A1.040, which is not in any of the books. Lucky me. And yes, I should have looked at that stamping instead of the one on the side of the block. Dooh.
Now, what should I do, bore the pistons .4mm or order smaller rings and be happy with it?
Thought that some of you might find this interesting.
Good night.
Eric Armstrong<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Not necessarily...<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]August 29 2000, 7:01 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->"WELL, guess what? It turns out that the 138.1 is actually a 1300cc block and a 138.2 is a 1500 block. The thing that has really thrown me is the pistons, which are from a 1500cc engine, ie deep piston relief. The only thing I can figure is that someone put 1500cc pistons in a 1300cc engine. "
You are correct about the block, but not about the pistons. The deep cast-in reliefs are also in the 1300 pistons, so that is not an indicator that they are from a 1500, especially is your bore is 86mm.
As for re-using the pistons, be sure to carefully inspect them to make sure they still meet spec before deciding to use them. Also, make sure the pistons/bore relationship is still within spec before re-using them.
-Lalo<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->So it's a late 1300....<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]August 29 2000, 8:30 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Hi Eric... I was expecting this. From your earlier e-mail, I was afraid your "1500" was really a late 1300. I have seen many '78 1300's with deep valve reliefs in the 86.0 pistons.
I know you were undertaking this project as rebuilding a 1500. The major difference between a 1300 and a 1500 is the stroke. (of course the block height and rod length and material are different too)
So if you want a 1500, you will have to go find one, or you can continue and rebuild the 1300.
Good luck,
Steve<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->Getting a head start on the Rally?<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]August 30 2000, 12:20 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<!-- google_ad_section_start -->So Eric, do you now have a rebuild candidate for the Rally? Or the 3p?
Time to haul out another 1500 to rebuild from under the workbench.<!-- google_ad_section_end -->
[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]