So close but need help - won't start!

User1 · Feb 14, 2009

<TABLE cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD colSpan=2><TABLE width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-TOP: 4px" vAlign=top colSpan=2>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]So close but need help - won't start!

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 4 2000 at 1:48 PM[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT> [/FONT]</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=bottom colSpan=3><HR></TD></TR><TR><TD colSpan=3>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Rather than wait for the 5 Spd 101 text to be fully published I went ahead and printed it all out, rebuilt the transmission and finally I got my 82 X all back together today. Very exciting moment to roll it outside (close enough to my van since the battery is dead so that I can jump start it) and got ready to start it up.

How frustrating!!! Engine turns but won't start. Now, a little history. I got the car in May. It had been sitting since last October when the transmission went. Transmission has been out since around November so it's been at least 8 months since the engine was turned over. When I got it in May I put in a gallon of gas (it had 1/2 a tank). No stabilizer - I thought I'd be done much earlier than now.

I hesitate to try and roll it down the hill and pop the clutch - I don't even know for sure that I fixed the transmission correctly, much less taking the chance of starting it that way.

Anyway - ideas? It sure sounds like it wants to start but just won't do it. It's a beautiful day here (Charlotte, NC) and I want to hit the road (although I know at this point it's not going to happen).

Any help is, as always, greatly appreciated!

Thanks - Tom

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Author[/FONT]</TD><TD>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Reply[/FONT]</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>steve ambrose <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]No Start

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 4 2000, 3:45 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Hi Tom, sorry to hear about the starting problem!
I would do a couple of things first. I assume it cranks over fast enough with your jump setup? I would replace the plugs(if they were marginal before, they are not going to want to ignite stale gas). Speaking of gas, it's easy to drain it on a fuel injected X. Just remove the hose from the bottom of the tank to the fuel pump, and drain it out. After putting in some fresh fuel, prime the system by pushing open the flap in the air flow meter with the key on for a minute or so. This will flush the fuel from the injector rail. Last but not least, pop the distributor cap and check for moisture. Hopefully this will fire it up. Good luck!
Steve

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Mac[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]excellent advice!

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 4 2000, 5:21 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Also be sure to check the simple things like fuses and the coil wire etc. We're with you! Let us know what happens! -Mac.



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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Jeff Zucker <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]I can relate-2 Xs with starting problems

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 4 2000, 5:35 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]My non-mod 87 and my 86 both do not start at this time. I was given many good points of advice on this forum about a month or so ago, but my schedule has not allowed me to try them out. If I have any success, I'll post as it may help you. Good luck! - Jeff

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]A little better

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 5 2000, 4:39 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]You know how difficult it is to sit at work all day knowing that your X is at home just calling your name! Anyway, finally got out of work and just tried some of the advice given:

Key On, Flap open inside the AFM. Fuel Pump is whirring away, after a bit I can definitely smell gas. Turn the key. No Start.

Distributor cap off - Rotor looks like garbage (almost melted). Scraped it a bit with a screw driver to clean it up a bit. Cap itself isn't too bad but could probably use replacing. Turn the key. No Start. Replacement parts will be ordered tomorrow.

Pulled the plugs. AAAAHHHHHH!!!!! Is there metal under here because all I can see is gunk. Not enough to think that the valves are leaking but they obviously haven't been replaced in a looonnnnnng time. Just for the fun of it I cleaned them all and replaced them. Turn the key. No Start. Again, replacement parts will be ordered tomorrow.

Double checked all of the spark plug wires, coil, etc. All look good. Didn't get out the meter yet to check resistance - anybody know what I should get as a reading (0 Ohms, a little bit, etc)?

Lastly, rather than replace the gas (as I have absolutely no where to dispose of it currently - not even any empty milk jugs sitting around and, much as that storm drain looks appealing I must do my part to save the environment

) I decided to just add a couple more gallons of new 87 octane gas. Haven't done that part yet - will get some in time for the new parts arrival (unless you guys are absolutely adamant about getting that gas out of there).

Getting closer - supposed to be a beautiful weekend here - sure hope to see it on the road somewhere instead of just sitting in my driveway!

Tom

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>steve ambrose <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Plugs!

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 5 2000, 5:04 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Hi again... if the plugs were ugly, it's far better to replace rather than try to clean. If you have any doubts about the quality of the gas, I'd drain it rather than add to the mess. Then run the fuel pump a bit more before trying to start it. The plug wires should be 10K-15k ohms at the most, but the easy test is to hold a wire (by the insulation!!) about 1/4 inch from the cam cover. A nice, fat spark should jump. If so, your wires, coil, etc are ok. Good luck!
Steve

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Ulix[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Buy a gas can

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 5 2000, 8:19 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]and drain the gas in there. Around here, you can take stuff like that to the houshold hazardous waste facility.

Ulix (brought them an X1/9 tank full of Diesel...)

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]3rd Day - still trying

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 6 2000, 5:26 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Picked up new plugs and a rotor today - installed both. Checked plug wires - all had resistance between 4 and 7 ohms. Pulled the plug in the cylinder closest to the coil; held it next to the head. Got a good spark while turning the engine.

Haven't drained the gas yet - need to pick up a few gas cans first (per Ulix's suggestion).

Anyway, still not starting. In going through the service manual I noticed that the charcoal canister should have a large hose coming out of the top - it doesn't. The curved large connector on the top of the canister is open and exposed. Searched and searched but couldn't find any hoses disconnected anywhere in the engine. Does this need to be connected? I know it's a part of the emissions system - could this be preventing the engine from starting?

As I mentioned, when I bought the car the transmission was out (in boxes in the front trunk) so I haven't seen (and can't remember) what it should look like.

One last thing - after attempting to start it several times I pulled the plug to check the spark. Expected to see a wet plug (with gas on it) but the plug was completely dry.

Ideas?

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Steven Lawson <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]one thought

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 6 2000, 5:37 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Pour a little fresh gas (not alot, maybe a capful or two) down the carb and see if it kicks over. If so, then it's probably not getting gas. If not, maybe bad timing or compression.

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>steve ambrose <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]More thoughts...

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 6 2000, 6:14 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Do we know that the car ran before trans removal?
If so, I'd first change the gas... If the plugs are dry, I would squirt a 3 second blast of "spray carb cleaner" into the open air flow meter flap. If it starts for a second or two, then you know that it's a fuel problem. You mentioned that the pump runs ok when the flap is opened on the air flow meter... this means it "probably" has fuel pressure. (should be about 37psi) if you have a gauge. If it runs with carb cleaner, and does have fuel pressure, then you have a problem with either: 1 the cold start valve or 2 all the injectors or 3 not getting any injector pulse from the computer. Do change the gas first, and run the pump to flush the lines as best possible.
Try it with a shot of carb cleaner(a couple times if needed. Let us know the results.. good luck, Steve

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Steven Lawson <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]oops...

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 6 2000, 8:30 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]for some reason I had the idea that this was a carb car. duh..


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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>David Ius <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Try "Aerostart"

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 6 2000, 9:17 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Don't know what you call it over there but it's basically ETHER in a spray can. Needs to be treated with EXTREME care but a 2 second spray in front of the AFM (no filter) while cranking will start the thing up if Fuel is your problem. If you STILL have a problem it will only run for a few seconds then die.

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Doc <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]we call it "starting fluid" <nt>

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 7 2000, 7:05 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial].

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Getting ready to drain

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 7 2000, 5:03 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Picked up a can of starter fluid today - tried a few times in the AFM and then finally pulled the big hose and went straight into the Intake Manifold. Nothing. Car just cranks and cranks.

I'll try to drain the tank this weekend but I'm thinking that it should have at least tried to start, right? What else would cause it to not want to catch?

Getting desperate - my replacement clutch slave cylinder should be here by Monday and I want to hit the road - it's been 15 years since I drove my last X and I'm so psyched about driving that I'm having trouble sleeping!

Tom

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Steven Lawson <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]hmmm...

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 7 2000, 5:18 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Lets see, you've verified a spark at the plug and you've supplied fuel via starting fluid and still not even a kick. Maybe timing belt is way off? If you hold your hand over the air intake while cranking, do you feel pulses of pressure - or even a complete lack of vacuum? My old Firebird slipped its timing chain and I would get suction followed by pressure that basically blew the charge right back out of the cylinder and resulted in a near total lack of compression. Didn't fire a bit.

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>steve ambrose <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Don't give up yet!

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 7 2000, 8:35 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Hi there, sounds like there is still something simple wrong with it... Now, did this car run when the trans was pulled out several months ago?
After trying the starting fluid, are your plugs wet? In the unlikely event that the cam timing is off, turn the motor over till the cam pulley mark is lined up with the pointer on the sheet metal. The crank should be at TDC now, and if you were to take the dist cap off, the rotor would be pointing at #4 plug wire.. The reluctor in the distributor should be just slightly past it's corresponding finger on the pickup coil. When you checked the resistance of the plug wires, did you take them out of the cap one at a time? I ask this because you mentioned in an earlier post that it had tried to start before, and now it seems to be doing nothing??!! If the plugs are really wet, I'd suspect too much starting fluid.. I'd say drain the gas, flush the lines with the fuel pump, inspect the plugs, verify cam timing, rough ignition timing, firing order (1342)and try a little starting fluid again.
Good luck, and hang in!
Steve

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Saturday Update - Could be enlightening!

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 8 2000, 6:58 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Tried various things this morning from the different posts; Still nothing. Here's a few things that I think could be important:

1 - Took out each plug (all still dry) and put a few drops of gas in each cylinder. No effect at all.

2 - Pulled the cold start injector - slightly wet when removed. Key on, finger in the AFM - I'd expect to see some gas come out of the injector - nothing. Cranked the engine a few times with the injector in a paper cup - still no gas coming out of it.

3 - Disconnected the fuel line in 2 places - Just after the fuel filter and at the cold start injector - both spots were under good pressure.

4 - Removed 2 1/2 gallons of gas (what a messy job that was) from the tank (only had 1 spare gas tank at this point). Before I go driving off to find a place to dispose of it I put it in my lawn mower (which was out of gas because I had used it all in the car) and it fired right up.

Checked the timing as much as I could with my limited knowledge - may have to get a buddy to come over for that one as I'm not really sure what I'm looking for. Rotor seemed to be where you guys suggested (near cyl 4 position). Verified all of the plug wires go to the correct cylinders for the stated firing order.

So, where does this leave us? I've got good fuel pressure but the plugs are still dry. Even with a little bit of gas in each cylinder it still won't catch. Starter fluid isn't doing a thing other than giving me a head buzz.

Oh yeah, to answer the question - The guy that I bought it from stated that it was running great. He was going down the highway, had trouble getting it out of 3rd gear, got it into 4th and then couldn't get it out at all. This seems to make sense with what I found with the transmission and, although this may be naive, he seemed to be a pretty honest guy. Just got divorced, didn't have the cash to fix the car, etc. Gave me all of the paperwork for the car showing regular oil changes, etc. So, did the car start before I got it - can't say 100% but I'm pretty sure (but I'm also a pretty trusting person)

Tom

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Mac[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]the world may never know...

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 8 2000, 9:32 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]...whether the PO was honest with you or not, unless we eventually meet him & find out he's really cool

What we DO know though, is that it's yours now & it won't start

We also know it takes fuel, spark & air to make this thing go, sooo...

First, put everything back together. The whole airflow meter/hoses/intake business, just put it all back together, and make absolutely sure there are no air leaks whatsoever beyond the intake mouth of the AFM. Even a 'small' amount of unmetered air entering the intake plenum (the big silver tube with /F/I/A/T/ on it) will kill the car fast as you can blink your eye

- but don't overtighten the connections either, they need to be snug, but not overtight, or it can distort the fittings & air will get in that way too

Also, when attaching all the connections on that big afm-to-plenum tube, be sure to check the tube itself for cracks anywhere or deformities at the connection points that could be allowing unmetered air into the system.

Now make sure the wiring connector on your airflow meter is on securely. Then go into the spare tire compartment (behind pass. seat) and behind the tire (if it's in there) you'll see the electronic control unit (ECU), with the big rectangular plug on it. IF that plug is not fastened securely, it would have big trouble kicking over. Also, the area is known to get wet in some Xs, and the plug can even be corroded

Gently lift up on the cable near the plug end, and see if you can wiggle it off of the ECU. If so that's a problem - there is a snap at each end of the plug, and one or both must be loose if you can just wiggle it off by the cable.

If not, look at the ECU for signs that it may have ever been wet (staining or any noticable corrosion near plug). If suspect, touch bare body metal (aka ground yourself) with one hand & then unplug the connector. If it looks good, put it back on. If not, you could use a q-tip to clean up in there & then some electronic contact grease on the ECU connector to keep the baddies out.

Then, (even though you probably checked already) just humor me one more time and look at all the fuses

Let us know what you find, and if the car still won't start after all this, we'll go another round with it. This Car Will Run!

-Mac.



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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Next Round

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 8 2000, 11:18 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Everything back together (except the air filter); checked all the fuses; checked ECU - nicely seated connector, no signs of any water or other damage. Everything related to the hoses/etc with the AFM to intake manifold look good and tight.

Checked the cold start injector while cranking the engine - got 8 volts on it.

What next?

[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]

[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>bob <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]I shouldn't say anything

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 8 2000, 5:01 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]cause I don't know squat about fi,,,but do you have a small round canister connected to your passenger side motor cover hinge, does it have a bare wire coming from it, is the bare wire touching the foil insulating material? If it is tape it so it cannot touch.
Do you have a 2" round thingy next to your water reservoir that has a vacuumn hose,,is it split or not connected?
Are you really really sure you are getting fire to the plugs--as a second check, try testing the plugs in the dark, you can see the spark much better and you can also see if any wires are arcing
See I knew I should have kept quiet 

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]At this point I'll take any advice

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 9 2000, 4:07 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 75px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Nobody should be shy about speaking up! I'm desperate and will check whatever is suggested (unless somebody asks me to check to see if the key is in the ignition!).

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>steve ambrose <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 90px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Basics...

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 9 2000, 10:00 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 90px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Hi Tom, this one is being obstinate! Am I correct in thinking that it's no longer "trying" to start, where as it was before? Plugs are still bone dry? Very strange! The cold start valve receives its + signal from the starter every time it cranks. It gets it's ground thru the thermo time switch.. only grounds when cold, and only for a few seconds.. The injectors receive + voltage from the FI double relay and their ground thru the computer.. a 12V test light should light brightly on one terminal, and flash dimly on the other when the car is cranked.
What area of town are you in? We could possibly take a peek at it?
Steve

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 105px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Far Away

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 9 2000, 10:45 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 105px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]I'm in Charlotte NC so I doubt an on-site visit is practical although very much appreciated.

No, it's no longer trying to start and to tell you the truth I'm not sure it ever really did try. Might have been wishful thinking although my wife agrees she did hear it just once.

I'm starting to think it's the ECU in the spare tire well - car is turning, sparks are flying, no gas. Strange think though is that I'm getting voltage to the injectors; could a bad ECU effect something else that would prevent starting?

I'm waiting on a slave cylinder for the clutch - should be here tomorrow. I'm thinking of putting it out on the hill and trying to pop the clutch (although that scares me because I just rebuilt the transmission).

Thoughts?

[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]

[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>David Ius <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 120px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Sorry if you covered this.

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 9 2000, 6:25 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 120px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Hi Tom.

You said that you checked the cold start injector and have voltage but I looked and couldn't find reference to checking the normal (4) injectors for voltage (it may be there, though). The cold start injector doesn't connect to the EFI at all. Pull a plug from one of the 4 injectors and look for some voltage there as you did before.

It may also be worth looking for proper fuel pressure (as opposed to fuel FLOW). Take the fuel hose off the cold start injector and put a fuel pressure guage there - should be about 35psi with pump running. What I'm thinking is if the fuel pressure regulator is stuck open the fuel will be pumped straight back to the tank and will not develop sufficient pressure to "squirt". If you are not able to get a guage try (carefully) pinching off the fuel return line and looking at the cold start injector for "squirt". This will CREATE fuel line pressure, but be REALLY careful (and quick) as excessive pressure (ie above 50psi or so) could cause fuel to spray everywhere and possibly damage the pump!

May be worth listening for the injectors with a long screwdriver on each whilst an assistant "cranks". You should hear a sharp "click" at regular intervals.

Problem I have is that NONE of my sugestions would explain why the bloody thing won't start on Aerostart.

Good Luck (can someone help Tom with some Italian swear words right about now?)

David

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>bob <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 135px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]damifino

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 9 2000, 8:23 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 135px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]really great Italian word,,it's an answer I give my wife everytime she asks what I'm doing.
take out your plugs, put some gas in there, it should start. If you have gas and air, and also have a spark, and it doesn't start, then it must be compression, right?
If it were me, I wouldn't try the hill,,,my experience has proven that pushing it back up the hill is not as much fun as you would think.

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 150px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]More to check

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 7:20 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 150px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]I've got all sorts of Italian swear words I've been using (I'm of Italian ancestry and my grandfather taught me all the really nasty words when I was about 10). So far the harsh language has failed to start the car (although it provides great entertainment to my neighbors as they see me jumping up and down in the garage!).

I've tried the gas in the cylinder trick - used an eye dropper to put 3 or 4 drops in each one - nothing.

Haven't checked each injector for voltage yet - I'll do that tonight as well as mess with the pressure suggestion.

I've decided that attempting the clutch popping is just not worth the risk of screwing up my freshly rebuilt transmission.

Okay, so I've got a few to-do's for tonight. Anything else that anybody wants to suggest?

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Gilles[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 165px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Magnetic pick up?

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 8:19 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 165px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Tom:
A few months ago I ran into a very similar situation, one day after work the car simply refused to start, so next day I brought from home my box of spares and started swapping components (I try to keep one of each)

The last thing I replaced was the distributor and started immediately, I don’t know if it was the magnetic pick up or just a loose connector but that took care of the problem. I hope this helps good luck.


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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Mac[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 180px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]worth a look! <nt>

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 8:21 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 180px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]

[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial] [/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top noWrap align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]

[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Ben[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 195px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]you've prob fixed it by now...

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]March 3 2003, 10:46 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 195px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]dont be a fanny and get the gas can out, pour a load of petrol in the cylinders then quicky slap the plugs back in. If it fires then its fuel, if it doesnt its ignition/maybe compression.
You have to remeber fuel evaperates quickly, sorry for the spellings.

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]One more thing

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 7:28 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]I just heard from the previous owner and he mentioned that when he got the car it wouldn't start either. Turned out that the ground strap was corroded - he said he cleaned it up, resoldered, etc and it started. Think this could be happening again here? I have the strap attached to one of the open holes on the top of the transmission - is there a more specific place it needs to go, certain way it needs to be connected, etc?

Tom

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Mac[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]tranny ground strap

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 8:25 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]As long as it is bolted directly to the chassis on one end & directly to the tranny case on the other, it's good. Beyond that, just make sure the strap is in decent shape (ie: not frayed almost in half) and that both ends can contact clean metal. A wire brush is the fastest way to fix the contact points up

-Mac.



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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>David Ius <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]For Testing purposes......

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 5:01 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 60px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial].....run a jumper anyway. Use a starting jumper lead (you know the flat battery type) from the engine to the body. That test costs $0 takes no time and will answer this question for good. I doubt it though, as the first thing that would fail is the starter (and you're cranking) but worth a go. Is the EFI ground on the cambox well secured?

Cheers

David

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Didn't get far tonight

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 10 2000, 5:46 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Our power was out yesterday from 3PM to 3AM - no A/C, about 90 degrees out, kid couldn't sleep, we were awake most of the night. Came home from work pretty tired and didn't do much (other than 2 new tires on the front).

Anyway, I'll compile all the latest suggestions and hit them tomorrow night with an update around 9PM EST.

Lots' O' good suggestions - hopefully one of them is going to do it! Thanks again!

Tom

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]I GOT IT STARTED!!!!!

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 5:15 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 15px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]I can't believe it - I finally got it started! Got home and started going through the checklist of to-do's that you all came up with. Took the connector off of the ECU, sprayed it with some WD-40, nicely reseated it, and it started trying to catch. Took a while, had to connect the battery to my van via jumpers because it started to die. After about 20 minutes it finally started up!

One thing I noticed when I finally got to the starting attempts - this car (don't know if it's true of all Fiats) doesn't like starter fluid at all. Each time I'd give it a little shot it would stop trying to catch. After waiting each time for about 3 or 4 minutes it would start catching again.

I've got a small oil leak and my slave cylinder parts didn't show yet so no test drive, but, now that the engine is turning I'm able (with the car off) to smoothly shift through all gears so I feel confident that the tranmission repair will be a success (with great thanks to the 5 speed 101 text and authors).

One final question for you guys on this topic - a real easy one - where does the reverse light connector plug in? I've looked everywhere and don't see the other end of the plug. Can't pass inspection if I don't have reverse lights!

Finally - MANY, MANY Thanks to all who contributed to this endeavor. Without your words of encouragement I'd still be sitting in the garage, top off, staring at the ceiling and making pretend engine noises!

This forum and its' participants are a truly priceless group!

Tom

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>David Ius <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Woooo Hooooo!!!

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 11 2000, 6:12 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Great work Tom!

Intersting about the starting fluid though. I must confess to never having needed it on the Fiat, but the V8 ski boat would crank all day when cold without it (choke removed) but with just 1 little squirt will start it in under 1 crank revolution! Well, you live and learn.

The plug for the reverse switch comes out behind the fuel pump. You should find a thin part of the loom through a few white plastic clips on the chassis cross member at the bottom of the firewall behind the gearbox (cabin side).

Ahhh - that first drive fter a long "layup" is the best reminder of why we love our X's. Go get driving!

Cheers

David

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Richard <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]CONGRATULATIONS ! ! ! ! !

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 12 2000, 8:16 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Tom,

From the previous owner, Thanks for hanging in there. I knew it would start sooner or later. Hope you enjoy her as much as I did ! ! !

Richard 

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>steve ambrose <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Good Job!!

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 12 2000, 9:15 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Way to hang in there Tom! Very happy to hear it's up and running! David answered your question about the b/u lights, so I'll just say "enjoy!!"
Steve

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>bob <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]And now the REAL fun begins

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 12 2000, 9:09 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Glad to hear that you are almost there.
One word of caution before you head off to the land of euphoria--after you drive for 10 or twenty miles, get back under and recheck your cv joint bolts(remember those 6 hex head bolts?) Mine came loose twice

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Will Do

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 13 2000, 4:58 AM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Good suggestion - I'm going to go back through and check everything one more time once it's had a good chance to vibrate around a little.

Can you believe I still haven't taken it out yet! Caught a cold and I'm just starting to feel a little better plus I needed 2 new tires and the company screwed up the size so I'm waiting on those!!!

Hopefully by the end of the day I'll at least get to go around the block.

Tom

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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Mac[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]woohoo!!

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 14 2000, 2:53 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 30px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]And it was the ECU plug??! Geezo man that was just a total blind guess!

Thank goodness you got it started - now the real fun begins!! Bwhooohooohoohaahahahaaa

Thanks for not giving up on that car! It will eventually repay you for your determination

-Mac.



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[/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top noWrap width="17.9%">[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]<SCRIPT language=Javascript>  </SCRIPT>Tom C <NOSCRIPT></NOSCRIPT>[/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px" vAlign=top><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD align=left>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Yep

[/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial][/FONT]</TD><TD vAlign=top align=right>[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]July 14 2000, 4:39 PM [/FONT]</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD style="PADDING-LEFT: 45px">
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana, Tahoma, Arial]Interesting thing was, just for the fun of it, I took the ECU apart - love to see what's inside those kinds of gizmo's. There's two brackets at the bottom that hold the two circuit boards together - they're totally rusted. I figure at one time it's been pretty wet in there. I can get the part new for $100 at Vick's auto online so I might just switch it out for the fun of it.

Just need to get the clutch adjusted a little better and I'm hitting the road this weekend!

Later! Tom

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So close but need help - won't start!

User1

RETIRED Admin, pm OFF