Big Man, Little Car

[TheTallOne]

It's been a while since I updated this thread, but progress has been made:

Cut out the whole floor

Made front and rear crossmembers for the flat floor, with holes for the coolant tubes

Made a rolling "frame table" that I can level to support the car for the next step. It was also good tig welding practice

I would like to thank my Dad for bringing the Quickjacks, it was so much faster and less stressful than how I got it on the rotisserie in the first place.

Finally, I just finished cutting out the whole tunnel, which brings things up to date

The next step(s) are acquiring a K24 & transmission, finalizing seat position which means buying a seat, the Cobra Imola wide for the driver, probably a cobra Monaco for the passenger since 2 Imolas next to each other are too wide to fit between the windows.

Once I get at least the drivers seat I will get mounts made up and relocate the center crossmember to a location that will best protect my rear from any road debris.

From there I can work out shifter, heater, ac and wire routing before building a new tunnel.

I will also have to cut out the mount point for the stock pedal box/steering support to give as much forward space for underfoot master cylinder pedals as possible. And I have found that I will have to use motorcycle chain and sprockets or a timing belt and cogs to shift steering input to a better position between and above the future brake and clutch pedals.

 

[545days]

I never sent you our extremely crude mock up photo from as couple of weeks ago, so I attached it below. I obscured your face in case you want to be Internet anonymous.

So this is how you fit a 6'-6" dude in an X1/9. Obviously the steering wheel is going to be a challenge. I don't remember if this photo had the 2x6 on top of the bar stool we used to mock up seating position, so the seat may be an inch and a half higher than pictured.

 

[Bjorn Nilson]

Lots of headroom and a lot of space for a cage, but very little legroom. There is a big risk you'll have the steering wheel between your legs when the seat comes in? Are you planning for a fuel cell in the frunk and cutting up the inner Firewall to be able to move the seat further back? That would give you a more straight up driving position with more legroom.

 

[TheTallOne]

Lots of headroom and a lot of space for a cage, but very little legroom. There is a big risk you'll have the steering wheel between your legs when the seat comes in? Are you planning for a fuel cell in the frunk and cutting up the inner Firewall to be able to move the seat further back? That would give you a more straight up driving position with more legroom.

I am still working out ergonomics, but moving the rear firewall further back doesn't win more space, because I am aiming to keep a stock position rear window. Right now my plan is for the steering wheel to land between my knees and my chest, with a quick release wheel and a tilt column to let me fold the shaft out of the way for comfortable entry/egress.

The only way I have to win more legroom is to lift my feet higher over the top of the steering rack, or entirely relocate the steering rack to a new location to free up that space, but I dont want to move the rack due to the cascade of other changes that will come from that.

I do plan for a fuel cell in the frunk, and will be making use of the former tank location to regain extra storage space I'll lose from that and other decisions

 

[kmead]

I will also have to cut out the mount point for the stock pedal box/steering support to give as much forward space for underfoot master cylinder pedals as possible. And I have found that I will have to use motorcycle chain and sprockets or a timing belt and cogs to shift steering input to a better position between and above the future brake and clutch pedals.

I would respectfully suggest moving the master cylinders to the frunk rather than trying to jam them inline in the passenger compartment as it just isn’t that long. Additionally servicing the system will be painful. Hussien in his build had a lengthy section of his thread showing how he made an adjustable balance bar, two master solution and fit it into the existing space as well as moving to an alternative clutch master.

Changing the steering to a convoluted system may not be a best approach. I frankly would say it is a bad idea.

If you want to maximize space in the passenger compartment due to your height/leg length, moving the master assemblies out of the passenger compartment is the best solution.

 

[kmead]

I am still working out ergonomics, but moving the rear firewall further back doesn't win more space, because I am aiming to keep a stock position rear window. Right now my plan is for the steering wheel to land between my knees and my chest, with a quick release wheel and a tilt column to let me fold the shaft out of the way for comfortable entry/egress.

The only way I have to win more legroom is to lift my feet higher over the top of the steering rack, or entirely relocate the steering rack to a new location to free up that space, but I dont want to move the rack due to the cascade of other changes that will come from that.

I do plan for a fuel cell in the frunk, and will be making use of the former tank location to regain extra storage space I'll lose from that and other decisions

Removing the firewall over the fuel tank would gain you @4” of space and not change the rear window location or installation.

 

[TheTallOne]

Removing the firewall over the fuel tank would gain you @4” of space and not change the rear window location or installation.

In order for me to fit a harness bar behind the seat and remain as reclined as possible to fit with a helmet on there is nothing to be gained. My head will already be as far under the targa bar as I am willing to put it.

In terms of the pedal assembly, I will not be using under slung or firewall mounted pedals. To have any chance of someone else driving this car, I am going to mount the pedals to the floor with a slider. Most likely the Tilton 600 series assembly, which already supports dual brake masters underfoot

The change to the steering shaft routing will likely be unavoidable, the input shaft of the rack is directly where my right foot needs to be no matter what I do to the seating position short of going for a single center seat, which I don't want to do. Things should begin to make more sense once I get the seat to mock up

 

[jimmyx]

I never have given much thought about modifying the steering in an X, but I have had my share of convoluted steering issues over the years. On my Dodge A-100 build, the front suspension is entirely a Corvette C-4. The rack centerline is just about centered under the driver's seat. The solution was to flip the rack 180 so the pinion was facing forward and use an Izusu Rodeo intermediate box to handle the shaft(s) directional requirements. Not sure if some version of this would work in an X, but there is always the option of an offset box. They are pricey, but not too tough to fab up with some motorcycle stuff. With the right combination of time and cash all things are possible. Keep us posted, curious minds want to know how you solve this one.....

8 Inch Offset Steer Clear Steering Box Drop-Brushed-3/4-36 Spline

Finally, a solution to the age old steering column/pedals problem. This nifty box provides unlimited options for steering shaft clearance so a high performance engine and headers will fit. Allows you to safely reposition the steering column higher, giving you more room for your feet and pedals...

www.speedwaymotors.com

 

[TheTallOne]

8 Inch Offset Steer Clear Steering Box Drop-Brushed-3/4-36 Spline

Finally, a solution to the age old steering column/pedals problem. This nifty box provides unlimited options for steering shaft clearance so a high performance engine and headers will fit. Allows you to safely reposition the steering column higher, giving you more room for your feet and pedals...

www.speedwaymotors.com

Something like that offset box is exactly what I'm picturing, I'll just wind up fabricating my own because that's a steep price tag! Thankfully I'm tooling up my lathe and mill, and a CNC plasma table should be joining soon to help out

 

[Rupunzell]

Some observations..

~Floor pan removal is ok long as the center tunnel/hump with the coolant tube housing structure is replaced in some way. There is a reason why the coolant tube housing has nee "100 spot welds". That housing is used to stiffen and strengthen the floor pan combined with the center tunnel on top. Long as some structure functionally replaces these oem designed in structures, you're good. One of the benefits of lowering the driver/passenger, that weight is placed lower in the chassis which is a good thing. Notable, the exxe does this to a modest degree with the dimple down floor pan (later 1500cc chassis) for driver & passenger seat.

~Forward to side visibility for the driver looking out the windscreen is more important than most realize. One of the often unspoken great designed in features of the exxe is forward/side visibility for the driver. This is of absolute importance to driving/controlling the exxe. This is one of the under appreciated perks of a mid-engine chassis (rear engine chassis can offer similar), the possibility of delivering an excellent view is often not appreciated. Compared to front engine/rear drive chassis with a long bonnet/hood and driver/passenger pushed back for the goal of weight distribution forces poor forward visibility for the driver.

~Driver ergonomics are of prime importance. Nearly universal practice for vast production cars is to adjust the driver seat to fit the needed driver's pedal position. Works ok enough most of the time within the limits of any given design. Real mid-engine race cars tend to have a fixed driver position with the pedals adjustable to fit the driver, consider doing this instead of a movable driver's seat. If this exxe is specifically fitted to you (driver) this will and can work good as a fixed driver's seat will dispense with the sliding seat rails and all needed to add those seat bits that take up precious space for the driver. Same applies to the steering, the idea of using an offset steering coupler can work. Alternatively, source a center pinion steering rack out of a real race car where center pinion steering racks are common almost always used due to the single seat config. Another possibility, source a right hand drive steering rack then add alterations as needed.


Bernice

 

[rozap]

Wow. This is an incredible amount of time and effort to make it work. You must really like the X1/9