how to replace / take out stater on a 1500

Ricardo Borja

Ricardo Borja

el moco
I'll try to save time and guts, if somebody have a tutorial will be welcome
how to replace / take out stater on a 1500 tutorial?

After many years of electrical bliss I am about to start repairing the following.
Starting the car I heard strange sounds while turning the key to start it, I thought about the battery,
when I turned it off and tried to start it again, the gear was not turning properly (you could hear it dragging)
so I thought that maybe the alternator was not working well, it was not giving enough charge,
although the indicator showed that it was charging well. What could it be? Bad battery or bad alternator?

taking out the battery to buy a new one, I realize that it is still under warranty, I go to Walmart and they do a battery test and it is fine..???
They tell me to leave the battery, that they were going to do some tests and recharge it,
I come home I reinstall the battery, I turn the key and now what??????
no solenoid noise no extraneous noise nothing
I tried "unsticking the starter with a screwdriver by shorting" but nothing happen.

the question is
want to change the alternator and starter

before to do or start the job, something do I need to know? I almost sure the starter is dead and needs to be replaced.
or some trick i need to know before to start

thanks on advance.

Riccardo
 
No tricks or surprises other than disconnect the battery first. Three bolts hold the starter to the trans. Don't forget to undo the wires to the starter first.
 
While you can replace the starter with a new one, they are often easy to fix. They often just need a good cleaning inside and a new pair of brushes. Before I would remove the starter, I would check the wiring to it and make absolutely certain it is not the wiring but the starter. I recommend that you check the voltage at the starter solenoid terminal and the motor terminal while the engine is being cranked.

Not sure what the "unsticking the starter with a screwdriver by shorting" procedure is but I would be careful with a screwdriver near the starter terminals as shorting the starter power lead to ground would likely have a major impact to the condition of your car. If you are referring to connecting the starter solenoid lead to the power lead, I would use a wire with clip leads.
 
Most common problem with Marelli and similar starters, worn and insulating powder from contact arcing..
What often cures the problem, take the solenoid starter contractor apart, clean the contacts real good, If they are badly pitted, replace them.
Brushes are the other problem area with bearings much further down on the problem list..

Modern alternative to the Marelli starter is replace it with a Denso mini..

Do make absolute sure ALL high current connections ( all battery connections, ground strap braid engine to chassis) are absolutely good and tight. Same applies to all the other electrical connections.

Bernice
 
I pulled the air cleaner assy to reach the top bolts easier. Others from underneath. Straightforward as everyone has said. A little fiddley getting the starter out & the OEM unit is heavy. No luck cleaning the starter, but I got a killer deal on a gear reduction unit from another member here. Check your trigger wire connection. My crimp connector was cracked so I replaced it when I did the starter.
 
Thank you for your support guys!

I read all your post and then I had the idea what to do and where to start to do this project.

I did all the job underneat the car, reach the bolts was easy, prior disconnect the battery of course.
I kept on my spare one starter from a late X1/9 BOSH brand and waiting for more than a decade to be use.
all was fine just this little detail.
My X1/9 is a 1979 with a BOSH electronic ignition, my alternator is BOSH and yes, my starter it was... MARELLI?
I review and measure diameters, location of bolts and connections and all it looks ok.

Installed THE STARTER BOSH with all cautions, once I connect the battery i didn't start the engine yet, review wires and touched to feel if it feels hot, when i turn the key engine try to start but i shut off (turn off the key) after many turns to start and off, i turn on the engine and all it looks ok.

what do you guys think?
 
Ricardo Borja said:
Thank you for your support guys!

I read all your post and then I had the idea what to do and where to start to do this project.

I did all the job underneat the car, reach the bolts was easy, prior disconnect the battery of course.
I kept on my spare one starter from a late X1/9 BOSH brand and waiting for more than a decade to be use.
all was fine just this little detail.
My X1/9 is a 1979 with a BOSH electronic ignition, my alternator is BOSH and yes, my starter it was... MARELLI?
I review and measure diameters, location of bolts and connections and all it looks ok.

Installed THE STARTER BOSH with all cautions, once I connect the battery i didn't start the engine yet, review wires and touched to feel if it feels hot, when i turn the key engine try to start but i shut off (turn off the key) after many turns to start and off, i turn on the engine and all it looks ok.

what do you guys think?
Click to expand...
The mountings for the starters are the same. My apologies it isn’t clear, did it turn the engine over or not it did not turn the engine over?

If you still have the click and the starter does not turn, it could be an issue with your ignition switch rather than the starter. It could also be bad connections at the battery or the ground connection at the battery or the ground strap from the engine to the body off the end of the transmission.
 
Rupunzell said:
Most common problem with Marelli and similar starters, worn and insulating powder from contact arcing..
What often cures the problem, take the solenoid starter contractor apart, clean the contacts real good, If they are badly pitted, replace them.
Brushes are the other problem area with bearings much further down on the problem list..

Modern alternative to the Marelli starter is replace it with a Denso mini..

Do make absolute sure ALL high current connections ( all battery connections, ground strap braid engine to chassis) are absolutely good and tight. Same applies to all the other electrical connections.

Bernice
Click to expand...
This ‘Denso mini’, is that just for 1500 model X19’s, or also earlier 1300, four-speed models as well? I noticed on MWB site that there aren’t any gear reduction starters for 1974 four-speeds…
 
tvmaster said:
This ‘Denso mini’, is that just for 1500 model X19’s, or also earlier 1300, four-speed models as well?
Click to expand...

They are available. I ordered my 1500cc one about 12 years ago, and they shipped me a 1300cc unit first (different vendor). I like it, and it's easier to install in my opinion.

 
myronx19 said:
They are available. I ordered my 1500cc one about 12 years ago, and they shipped me a 1300cc unit first (different vendor). I like it, and it's easier to install in my opinion.

Click to expand...
Hey, I recently watched your video on Youtube! :)
After some Googling, I see that they are out-of-stock on the four-speed versions. MWB removes the unit from the web site if it's out-of-stock. Another vendor has some. Are there any other manufacturer's units that would work and be easily installable, besides the ones MWB sells?
 
kmead said:
The mountings for the starters are the same. My apologies it isn’t clear, did it turn the engine over or not it did not turn the engine over?

If you still have the click and the starter does not turn, it could be an issue with your ignition switch rather than the starter. It could also be bad connections at the battery or the ground connection at the battery or the ground strap from the engine to the body off the end of the transmission.
Click to expand...
"The mountings for the starters are the same. My apologies it isn’t clear, did it turn the engine over or not it did not turn the engine over?"

Hi karl,
Sorry, just I didn't finish my comment, and thank you very much, I reviewed all the point you marked, and yes all it was ok.

The X start without any issue, just my cautions to be sure do not have any issue on the future. ( to exchange the starter MARELLI for a BOSH )

Today i'll start the engine again on my X, if i see any kind of malfunction I'll turn for a brand new starter. ( no sense to change if it runs good)

thanks Karl,
 
Denso mini can be configured or made for either 1300cc or 1500cc, difference is in the flywheel ring gear diameter. It is also why the 1300cc -vs- 1500cc starters are not interchangable. Depending on how the Denso mini starter is converted to fit the Lampredi SOHC, the body can be rotated on the mounting adapter. This allows "clocking" of the Denso starter body for a better fit.

As for Marelli -vs- Bosch, they are near identical design, construction, and quality of materials and build. Another myth of "German" superior quality, design and all that.. The Denso is good due to modern design, production methods, modern materials and Japanese vast production expertise.

Bernice
 
Rupunzell said:
Denso mini can be configured or made for either 1300cc or 1500cc, difference is in the flywheel ring gear diameter. It is also why the 1300cc -vs- 1500cc starters are not interchangable. Depending on how the Denso mini starter is converted to fit the Lampredi SOHC, the body can be rotated on the mounting adapter. This allows "clocking" of the Denso starter body for a better fit.

As for Marelli -vs- Bosch, they are near identical design, construction, and quality of materials and build. Another myth of "German" superior quality, design and all that.. The Denso is good due to modern design, production methods, modern materials and Japanese vast production expertise.

Bernice
Click to expand...
I am very pleased with my gear reduction starter in my 850, I will be putting one in my dented X later this summer.
 
kmead said:
I am very pleased with my gear reduction starter in my 850, I will be putting one in my dented X later this summer.
Click to expand...
After all and it looks like I'll have to replace the switch motor too, I think I'll put it on my " list to do on my X" to get a new "gear reduction starter" on the early future.
Right now I started a new thread asking to replace the switch motor...

Thanks again Karl.
 
I recently dealt with starter issues & took my 38 year old OEM Marelli unit to be rebuilt. They couldn't locate a solenoid for it. I had an old takeout Bosch unit & brought it to the rebuilder. They had all the parts on the shelf to fix. While it was being rebuilt I got a gear reduction unit from another member & installed it. Love the way it spins the motor & the rebuilder said it would probably draw less amps as well. Only drawback for me is it now sounds like a Honda starting, not the Fiat I've had for years. Put the rebuilt Bosch on the shelf as a spare.
 
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