Looking for 2.25" crossflow muffler

Ulix

Ulix

True Classic
We are building a very long 4-2-1 exhaust right now out of a long Vicks header. (I will report when it's done).
The header takes up a lot of room, so the only option we are seeing right now is a crossflow muffler with inlet and outlet on the same end.
(Tailpipe needs to go to the left, 1974 car).
Should be 2.25".

This Flowmaster would fit, but it is 2.5" and way too loud. We are looking for fairly quiet and no drone.
https://www.flowmastermufflers.com/...offset-in-250-same-side-out-aggressive-sound/

Magnaflow has one, but it is 2.5" also.

Does anyone by any chance know of one?
I know it's a longshot, but some people here have done a lot of exhaust work.
 
I have used the adapters before to change the muffler, just cut the outlets off the muffler close to the muffler body and weld the 2.25" adapter on to the stub you left and you have a 2 1/4" muffler.

As for mufflers let us know if you find one that is fairly quiet but still sounds good.
 
Ulix said:
We are building a very long 4-2-1 exhaust right now out of a long Vicks header. (I will report when it's done).
Click to expand...
Ulix, I've considered this very same idea. Please keep us informed (maybe even a little preview of your design?). Thanks.
 
View from the bottom.
Top of pic is rear of car.


F1BC84A4-7573-4163-A117-43AF05C6F591.jpeg
 
Thanks for the pic Ulix.
I'm a big fan of the 4:2:1 design, really liked the old ANSA system. A few years ago some of us did a little research about designing a new version of it (you might have participated in that discussion?). Based on that info I was thinking about having the primary tubes a little shorter and the secondary ones a little longer. Same concept as you, but perhaps something like this (sorry for the crappy art work):

First join the primaries about here (same for each pair, front and back)...using 2 of the same type "Y" you did:
fiat_parts_27-6919.JPG


Then take those two secondaries around the 90 degree and 180 degree bends, and finally join them (again, like you did):
fiat_parts_27-6919.JPG


Same concept, just a little different placement of the "Y"s to get the tube lengths different. The draw-back to this version is it involves more fabrication to lead the pipes around those paths.
 
Hey Ulix. Hope all is well with you.

IMHO, that 2.5" in/out muffler is just too large of pipe diameters. I reckon it will drone pretty bad, but who knows....

You should be looking for something more like 2". But yeah, will be much harder to find..

This should work better - see pic below - but may not be too easy to find over there !!! Rear muffler from late ' 80s Datsun/Nissan 200SX. Bosal # 286-959. Inlet and outlet on same end of muffler. Did you even get those cars over there ? I have 3 of them in stock here, but the shipping to you would be gross.....

Same muffler - but without the attached long inlet pipe on mine - is available from AP Exhaust part # 700086. Google it and you should find some pics. Even shows up on Ebay.de - but from a USA vendor. But seems to show only 15 euros for shipping to Germany......

Let me know if you need any dimensions or more info. Cheers, Doug
200sx muffler 001.JPG
 
Hi Ulix. That's a nice piece of work. Did you model the exhaust at all? When I was working on developing the exhaust for my DSP X1/9 I found that the 4-1 made excellent torque, once I got the length right. You mentioned the DynoMax. DynoMax also makes a line called UltraFlo. I use this one on my DSP X. It worked very well so I put another one on my '74. It flows well and isn't too loud. http://www.dynomax.com/mufflers/ult...stainless-steel-polished-offset-centered.html
 
For the sake of options, this is how I went on my ‘74 with the same header:

7FF7C6F3-831D-4F01-BE1D-93ADF94E2840.jpeg



Ulix said:
We are building a very long 4-2-1 exhaust right now out of a long Vicks header. (I will report when it's done).
The header takes up a lot of room, so the only option we are seeing right now is a crossflow muffler with inlet and outlet on the same end.
(Tailpipe needs to go to the left, 1974 car).
Should be 2.25".
Click to expand...
 
Hi Mark,

nice design.
20 years ago, I bought a used PBS header with a similar exhaust on it. It also had small diamter bullet mufflers like yours.
It was insanely loud. I attributed that to the small diameter of the mufflers. But maybe they were blown out since they were used.

How loud is yours?
Does it drone on the highway?
 
Hi Doug,
thanks for your comments.
My car will have a hi-po 1.9L, so I feel 2" is too small.
Drone resulting from too large a pipe diameter is a valuable info.
We are checking into the cost of having a muffler made.

I looked into the SX200 exhaust. The car was called Silvia over here and it seems that the muffler was not used in the euro model since there is no info to be found on either of the two part number you posted.
I will send you a PM, maybe you can provide the measurements anyway.
 
I use 2.25 mufflers on the 1500's I build, but drop the tailpipe size to 2 inch which quietens it down and I have no problem with drone.

With your engine being 1.9, maybe use the 2.5 muffler and reduce the inlet size to 2.25, and go 2 inch on the short tailpipe section.

SteveC
 
Hi Steve,
that is a promising approach.
Have you checked out whether the smaller tailpipe costs power?
 
It makes an awesome sound. It’s quiet at idle and lower rpms but it really sings at higher revs. No droning though.


Ulix said:
Hi Mark,

nice design.
20 years ago, I bought a used PBS header with a similar exhaust on it. It also had small diamter bullet mufflers like yours.
It was insanely loud. I attributed that to the small diameter of the mufflers. But maybe they were blown out since they were used.

How loud is yours?
Does it drone on the highway?
Click to expand...
 
Ulix, I did a lot of modeling and determined that the 2.25" was optimum. I did test a 2" as it was easy to try and I seem to remember that it didn't make as much power. IIRC the fat part of the torque curve gave up a couple of ft/lbs. I didn't test a 2.5" on the DSP car because the model said it was too big. I did test a 2.5" pipe on a 1500 that had head work, a cam and dual 40s. It was still too big. I really don't remember the numbers now (it was a long time ago) but again, it was midrange that was hurt.
 
Ulix, one thing to remember when sizing exhaust and mufflers; stepping up the ID in the pipe after the collector is not a good idea. It stalls the velocity and raises the back pressure. Velocity is good which is why its easy to oversize the primaries and collector. There is one exception to that rule and its the Burns Stainless "merge collector". This is a carefully designed and sized expansion chamber immediately following the collector. Its purpose is to create velocity through the collector. It works well but does require careful design for the principle to work properly. http://www.burnsstainless.com/mergecollectorsmain.aspx
 
Ulix, Interesting project. I recall some advice on the topic from Guy Croft's forum: "...One thing is indisputable however and at complete variance with anything known even 5 years ago never mind 20, and that is that 4-2-1 on a cylinder inline engine gives a 'fuller' (more driveable - and I don't mean for going shopping..) torque curve than 4-1. You may take that as fact, even if both systems show the same peak power or the 4-1 slightly more. The 4-2-1 - if right for the engine - will always be better." He then suggested the following for a 1500cc engine:
4-2-1
Primary 1.5 inch OD, 28 inch long
Secondary 1.75 inch OD, 12-14 inch long
Final 2.25 inch OD
I'm looking forward to your impressions once you complete yours. Thanks, terry
 
Terry, that is basically the same conclusion we came up with a few years back when some of us on Xweb designed a new header for the X...although I'd have to look back at the exact sizes we determined (I'm thinking we came up with a 2" final dia?). But the 4:2:1 design is especially well suited for a street car engine that is not 100% built to the limit like a racer.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top