Progress on my 74

[remofromcanada]

I finally pulled the motor with the transmission last week and got the motor onto a stand today. I drained the oil in the motor and there was coolant in with it..not good. In the midst of taking out the motor and transmission, I somehow broke off the little plastic drivegear for the speedometer that comes off the transmission. Hopefully I can get a replacement.

This motor is going to need some serious work, but I think it will be fun, and worth it in the end.
I am definetly going to use Ford edis components along with megajolt for this build.
I just wish it wasn't so cold here in Edmonton.

 

[remofromcanada]

Happy New Year!, more progress.

So I took it all apart in about 3 hours. Headgasket was for sure blown and pistons 2 and 3 are stuck in the block, but they are soaking in penetrating oil.

Do you think these pistons are salvageable?
if i'm going to use an alternative intake manifold, how do i shut the coolant holes in the head? Just weld them up?
i'm going to replace the oil pump for sure.
Pictures say a thousand words....

More progress to come!

 

[Xmember]

good job... that motor looks umm... yucky :wink2: how long did it sit?

 

[bbrown]

R.I.P. that motor

Looks like you'll be better off getting another.
That engine will need to be completely reworked by what I see.
My :2c:

 

[remofromcanada]

that is what I intend to do. I'm going to bring it to my local engine and head shop and have it completely redone. I don't think those pistons will work, they are too corroded. This motor sat for a very long time, but the car was garaged.

 

[Xmember]

head shop

imp:






but seriously that motor is toast... You should drop a busa motor in it :nod:

 

[remofromcanada]

I dont think the motor is toast. I think the pistons are. I figure i need to replace the oil pump, water pump, maybe the alternator, get some new pistons, maybe new rods and bearings, different cam with new valves and springs. I wanted to rebuild this engine, it's kinda what makes the car special to me. I want to change a few things but keep it pretty close to stock.
I think this engine needs some good TLC, but i need to bring it in and see for sure before I get too ahead of myself.

 

[Xmember]

I understand where your coming from, but for the amount of work and machining to get the walls and head right, plus the need for over bore pistons, new pins,valve seats and machining etc etc etc you would come out a lot better off IMO to find a good twin cam and drop in there or possibly just another good X1/9 motor. If your planning to do a full concours resto and take it to Pebble beach, then Id say yes by all means use the original motor and while at it don't throw any parts away, send them out to be refurbished. If you want a Busa I know a place near by, the guy only wants like $1900 for the engine/harness/ecu its a pick n pull

Check this vid at around 1.30
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUy400qsbwM"]YouTube- Fiat x19 and the Dallara x19[/ame]

 

[EricH]

As long as your eyes are open...

I dont think the motor is toast. I think the pistons are. I figure i need to replace the oil pump, water pump, maybe the alternator, get some new pistons, maybe new rods and bearings, different cam with new valves and springs. I wanted to rebuild this engine, it's kinda what makes the car special to me. I want to change a few things but keep it pretty close to stock.
I think this engine needs some good TLC, but i need to bring it in and see for sure before I get too ahead of myself.

I've rebuilt/repaired stuff when a pure dollars and hours calculation tells me to scrap and replace instead. I expect that at one time or another we all have. So as long as you are going into this with your eyes open... more power to you.

The cylinders may be gone beyond reboring (the rust in #2 and #3 looks ugly, and stuck pistons are always bad news); the deck surface may be too trashed to resurface; the block may be cracked. If that's the case, then the engine is truly gone and you'll be looking at starting with another short block (Matt for $350, or see who has one in their parts cache).

But if you get past these hurdles, chances are that if you put enough time and work into it, and replace enough other stuff, you will get a sweet-running engine out of it. If all the damage has been done by long standing and neglect, you'll likely find that at least the block, crank, rods, and head casting can be saved. Just expect to spend more dollars and a lot more hours on it than an outright replacement would cost.

 

[DanielForest]

Hi Remo,

Yes, EVERYTHING could be rebuild. But is it worth it?

Keep yours for spare and find a better one to start with. I don't say it have to be already rebuilt. Danny Besharah in Carlsbad Springs (near Ottawa) do have plenty of used and new X1/9 parts for the right price. Or you may find something local. I was in Saskatoon last spring to race at the ASN Canadian AutoSlalom Championship and some fellows told me there was a scrapyard nearby with a nice looking X1/9 in there.

Even the head, you can find some good ones for less than 100$. A little more money to invest right now, but better results for less job in the end.

Don't ask me how I know!

Daniel Forest
Montreal
1987 white Bertone X1/9
1980 black Fiat X1/9

 

[remofromcanada]

Finally got the #2 and #3 pistons out, wasn't that hard after a day with penetrating oil. The walls look quite rusty and i'm going to bring in the block and head this week to have them checked out and then go from there.

 

[haywood j]

hey Daniel

Is Canadan still around?

 

[Robert Mose]

He is still around....

The last time I saw him, (last spring), he was getting out of the Fiat business. He stored all his NOS stuff for a rainy day and any scrap cars, engines, or transmissions were sold for scrap metal. I imagine alot of good engines got scrapped.

I might drop him a line next time I pass through Ottawa.

 

[Xmember]

The last time I saw him, (last spring), he was getting out of the Fiat business. He stored all his NOS stuff for a rainy day and any scrap cars, engines, or transmissions were sold for scrap metal. I imagine alot of good engines got scrapped.

I might drop him a line next time I pass through Ottawa.

Probably bec the world economy is the crap right now. Its a shame that uncommon cars such as the X, along with the increasingly scarcity of parts for them are becoming casualties of war and being scraped I know Ive sent 3 X1/9's to the grave in my time.:wall:

 

[haywood j]

Quite a character

good thats he's still around :nod:

sorry for side tracking your post remo :whistle:

just gave away my parts x which had a running plant with less than 40k on the clock, keep your eyes peeled there's stuff around if ya need.

 

[remofromcanada]

Ok
i've been doing a little bit of research on this site and checking the old one too and there are so many combination of carbs and cams and heads and size of valves. I really need a little bit more help to know the direction I want to go.

I'm going to bring the block and head in this week to have them checked out. If the block is ok, then he will tell me what size pistons I need once they are cleaned up. I really would love to bring this motor to 100 hp. I'm definetly going to be using carburators off of a motorcycle because of their availability and cost. Megajolt also looks to be a very good program to be used with the TPS of the carbs that I use.

What I need help with is the head mods. If I bring in the head to a shop to have it reworked, and want to have larger intake valves what size and angle and valves should I be using? I know I could prob ask the guy at the shop but I figure there is much more combined experience with these motors on this site. I'm basically looking for a combination of valve size/ angle grind, valve spings, cam and also brand and type of pistons I should be looking at as options.

If I change the intake manifold, how do I close the coolant passages in the head? just weld them up? If i'm going to ditch the mechanical fuel pump can I simply remove it and block it off with a plate?

This is not really a budget build on the motor. I want it to have more pep with the right parts even if they are a little bit expensive, but I dont want to be throwing thousands and thousands at it.

 

[Xmember]

but I dont want to be throwing thousands and thousands at it.

hmm.. might wanna rethink Fiats in general :wink2:

seriously though, your first line of business is to decide what your planning to do with the car. Reading your other posts it appears you want a spicy DD. Dont worry to much about an ultimate HP number. 100hp isnt streach by any means, but what that 100hp does and how it does it is very important. Contact Matt Brannon, hes very very good at suggesting engine setups for various applications. You already have Steve in your corner on suspension, so when its all said and done your X is going to be a little rocket on rails.

 

[remofromcanada]

I finally rented a valve spring compressor and got to taking apart the head and all of the components. The valve seals were shot and the valves are toast also. again, pictures say a thousand words.

I am still deciding what I should do with this head to get more power out of it. I'm thinking of enlarging the valves and getting some performace valve springs and a performance cam. At least now I can bring it in to the machine shop.
any comments, and opinions are greatly appreciated but i AM using this motor unless the dude at the machine shop says it's no good.
Thanks
Remo

 

[EricH]

Head options/mods

but i AM using this motor unless the dude at the machine shop says it's no good.

I'd be inclined to get the engine working in close to stock trim before I started working on increasing power output. Until the car is running, you won't really have a good feel for how much you want to trade drivability for power, not torque for revviness.

Does using this motor mean using the head as well? A ready-to-go head with valves installed is $429 from Matt, so that's your benchmark as you decide what to do with your existing head. One possibility (not the least expensive, but then you're not in this to save money or you would have installed a used running engine already) would be to build and drive the car using one of Matt's heads, while working on a performance head as a longer-term project.

There's a fairly recent thread in which Steve C describes how to unshroud the valves on that style of head (NA 1100/1300, combustion chamber doesn't extend full width) and of course milling the head and/or block will increase compression.

 

[remofromcanada]

I really don't see the point of building the engine as close to stock specifications if i'm just going to rip it down again for power. I don't know about you but I don't have that kind of time or money. Time and research are essential, and I don't think it would be wise to take steps backwards instead of forwards.
I've already looked into a head from Matt but those come with stock components and then I wouldn't have the self satisfaction of rebuilding it myself.