Supercharged 4AGZE powered X

One last point. I've never seen a battery explode due to accident damage. Saw one flashover when a jump-starter was connected to the electrode posts once on a cracked battery but that just blew out the safety bung and showered everyone with acid.
Click to expand...
Well the last wreak I was in the lady that hit me watched her car burn to the ground....well almost to the ground before the fire truck showed up. The fender/hood tweaked in such a way that one of the body panels shorted across the posative and negative battery posts. And I guess the hygregen fumes (a by product of hyrdacloric acid) that a lead acid battery can emit are combustable. enough to blow the top off the battery and somehow in the mix the fuel lines not more than a foot away made of plastic leaked fuel and caught on fire. Or maybe it was a reversal of what I'm saying i don't know.... I just know there was fire and the battery blew up and there were arc marks on the hood area from the battery posts.
regardless I saw a tech charging a battery and decided to loosen the battery terminal at the same time....acidentially arcing between the two posts igniting the hydragen fumes and thankfully no more than that because he was not wearing safety glasses. So lead acid batteries in them selves can be a flamable hazard.

Another point is this, which immersed fuel pump are you refering to? Most cars designers affix the fuel pump to the engine block (front engine installs) with the fuel tank between or in front of, the rear wheels for protection. It's more efficient to pull a column of fuel along a fuel line to where it's needed that to try and push that fuel from the back of the vehicle forwards. Pumping frictional losses work that way.
Click to expand...
I would say that perhaps it's been quite some time since you have worked on a modern car. At least here in America. Where EVERYTHING literally has in tank fuel pumps with wires going to them with system voltage on them. And although they are brushless pumps the wiring including the connectors are still submerged in fuel. Every single chevy truck since the early 90's are produced like this to this day. Every subaru, toyota, honda, kia, ford, dodge, that I have ever had to work on in the last 14 years as a professional automotive technitian has a fuel system like this. And modern fuel systems (within the last 5 years) have not changed much. they are all plastic tanks now with plastic fuel lines. With the pump in tank and a returnless fuel system meaning the regulator and return line from regulator are part of the fuel pump sender assembly in the tank and one fuel line goes through a filter and all the way to the engine providing in excess of 50psi.

But before this thread gets hi jacked I'm going to shut up and go on with life.
I agree that anything arcing a battery is not good.... in the presence of a fuel source weather it be a fuel tank, fuel lines, or fuel rail. Arcing a battery is also not good for a lead acid battery as if there is enough hydrogen fumes built up they will ignite. And although any arc (from battery voltage or just friction from a wreak) caused for any reason is an ignition source for any type of combustable weather it be gasoline, hydrogen fumes, or a very strong mixture of window washer fluid.
And I guess I'm just saying that I would focus on containing the battery in it's own enclosure to maintain a safety standard. The battery to me is the problem.... even though in the car world there are main power wires and fuel lines strung in somewhat close proximity of each other including power wires for the fuel pump.
But I think you're point here is if something were to arc the battery or any of it's wiring in the presence of a fuel leak it would be bad.
And my point is that a starter wire can arc just as easily and ignite a fuel leak in the engine bay vs the battery arcing and blowing up the fuel tank if it were leaking.... in both scenrios the fuel tank can still blow up.
This is why I prefer a gel style battery with good protection for the terminals and then it doesn't matter.
 
Sorry Matt,

Hydrogen (there is no 'a' in the word) can only be released by damage caused in a shunt. Most batteries are sealed for life types. Your contention that, for whatever reason, the lady's car was consumed by fire due to the battery exploding, is spurious at best.
You allude to my age, indirectly, but with age comes experience. Here's the rub - as you rightly point out, times have moved on in the last 30 odd years, as one would expect. Are you saying that a home built special created by an unknown engineer in South Africa, has engineered a special version of the Fiat X1/9 that addresses all the production improvements made during this time and before, or are you saying that my caution and advice is inappropriate to the question posed by the current owner, i.e. what do we think of his car?
Matt, if you wish to run around in a car configured with a fuel tank in the same compartment as your battery - fine - I have absolutely no problem with that. However, if you are saying that current and past safety practice is in error then I'm sorry but I cannot agree.
With age comes experience - otherwise we'd all be pushing hand carts. You can dismiss my comments if you wish - that's your prerogative - but as most who post on this site would agree - on matters of safety at least, I would ask for your respect without rancour.
 
Several years ago...

I relocated the battery in my '71 124 Spider from the engine bay to the trunk as was typical in the later Spiders. After going to all the work and getting everything hooked up -what was the first thing I managed to do? yep arced the damn thing with a wrench and got an immediate singe from the fuel vapor that popped. Not way surprising as the fuel tank is right under where the battery was located and separated by a Masonite 'firewall' . I didn't re-relocate the battery but I sure as hell was very careful around that battery after that. Don't really understand your whole point about the in tank fuel pumps-I mean if they are designed to be in the tank then they are designed to be in the tank without exploding,right? What has that got to do with an arcing battery? Confused on that one:huh:
 
The point was ....

lost in the developing difference of opinion between Matt and me. My only point was that a battery, subjected to immense forces in a frontal collision could be crushed and provide a spark which may ignite a broken fuel tank's contents - nothing more.

Oh, unless you were to take his comments about progress since the '70s as a rebuke for me having vegetated for the last 30 years and learned nowt since my chemical engineering degree, Health & Safety qualifications, Chairpersonship of the Sterilizer Club, editor of the X1/9 OC UK, technical officer for eight years of same, editor for two years of the Sporting Fiats Club and past owner of twelve X1/9s. In my career I've been a Product Manager for three companies and a Business Development manager for two, all within the scientific field selling and marketing the likes of surgical instruments, radiology equipment, endoscopy systems, automated blood analysis machines, not to mention infection control and pharmacy automation. Now, of course, I'm a boring old fart and can't be trusted to accommodate new technologies and methodologies. Better cancel my Open University course on Laser Ablation Techniques and concentrate on immersed fuel pump advances over the last 30 years on american automobiles.
It's probably my fault. I was brought up to never use the term 'doctor' as I was expected to be working with so many that the term would be redundant.

Once upon a time I was editing the !icsunonove! mag for the club and a very serious qualified gentleman, (a 'doctor') with lots of letters after his name, wrote an article which had been accepted by my predecessor. Honour bound to publish it (as per precedent) it gave very detailed instructions as to how to cut grooves into a blank disk brake in order to increase its braking efficiency. Additionally it added a 'how to' section on drilling what was left to further help with stopping. Mindful of the youthful exuberance of the mag's readership I felt it appropriate to point out to the reading membership, that the article was, in no way, a recommendation for any members to immediately fix their front stoppers in a vice and attack them with the recommended carborundum disk and De Wolf hand drill.
That ryder got me into deep clag with said member for some two years. Did I relent or recant? No. For all my effort was concerned in saving lives lost through ignorance of the options available.

I would, and will, never flinch from that principal. Ever.

As the Sage observed "Those who would ignore the mistakes of history are doomed to repeat them".

Age may not impart great wisdom - but it sure as Hell developes over time a healthy respect for breathing!:fart:

Tell 'em Tony!
 
Last edited:
eh... I'll agree with the
lost in the developing difference of opinion between Matt and me
Click to expand...

He's just saying that an arc can ignite fuel. And I agree with him.

No need for apology. I'm just trying to understand you're point. And I think I understand where you're coming from.

Sorry about my spelling and the debate.
 
HA... I LOVE BOTH YOU GUYS!

Now that you realize yur really on the same page!

Geez... I'm exhausted... Later...
 
Coming along it sounds.

Are you measuring the idle with the X's tach? I personally think the X (tach) will show a tad lower than actual rev count and if it says 1200, it might be actually really be a tad lower -IMO. My stock FI car runs smooth at about 1,000 according to the tach, but lower than that and its rough.

Keep on it!​
 
Is the 4A-GZE running off the stock Toyota ECU? If it is you will need to find the diagnostics plug.
You have to jumper Pin E1 and TE1 in the connector to be able to set the base ignition timing and the base idle. Otherwise you're just fighting the ECU in you're adjustments. Before you actually perform a base idle and ign timing adjustment you need to set the TPS correctly as this adjustment effects the other two because the TPS has a idle contact in it.
Once the TPS is set then base ignition timing and then finally base idle speed then you can move on in the diagnostics. Many times these three adjustments take care of a lot of issues.
 
Tiny cracks by windshield

All in all looks like a nice car. The tiny cracks though is a concern. You had mentioned rust under the dash over the master cylinder. That may or may not be causing the cracks. A loss of structure there could be causing flexing in the body of the car... "your cracks" especially since the cracks and the rust are in the same general area. Might be worth looking in to. Just a idea.
 
Sorry Dave,
I saw this on the flat black alfa thread and thought of our disscussion. lol.
I personally like this install.... but anything could happen.
!B4OH+Vg!mk~$(KGrHqZ,!jIEyeIj4Ge1BMpCj3wL-Q~~_3.JPG
 
Lots of interest in the tank here. My plan is to take the intercooler out of the fuel tank spot and put it back on top of the engine as per a normal 4agze, then to find a standard x19 tank and put it where it belongs.

But before I get to that I need to get it licensed. Holding thumbs for tomorrow, the red tape here gets a little ridiculous. Then I want to sort out the wheel bearings, breaks and to fit a quieter silencer. I hate noise. Speaking of which I have huge amounts of noise coming in at highway speeds. Could that be the wheel bearings or are x19's just noisy cars?

After that it'll go to a top tuner to get the engine mapped correctly (it has an aftermarket ECU). Then the interior needs some serious work done. Cover everything in leather, recover the seats etc.

Edit, oh yes, found a drop of brake fluid on the master cylinder. Are the seals something i could find at an auto parts store or do they have to be specially ordered?
 
Last edited:
i could be wrong

hey,

How's it going i am doing this conversion myself and i could be wrong but i can't see how your supercharger isn't in the standard position. It has all its standard intake pipes throttle body is in the original location this all bolts off the blower. Which is going to hinder your plans if i am correct.

I would say it is more probable what your looking at is the alternator as it is mounted down very low and proturdes into the cabin. The distributor also proturdes into the cabin. A few other issues you may have are the gear linkage setup might also foul the fuel tank this is the issue i have but i am custom making a braket to get around this problem. Its taken alot of time to get the engine position in the right spot to not foul things. I am hoping i should get away without having to remove my fuel tank and rear boot.

The x1/9 is a generally pretty noisy car wind noise isn't horrendous but when compared to a new car its pretty bad if thats what your using as a base line.

Anyway cheers i hope i am wrong i would love some more pics of the mounts if possible and gear linkage setup.
 
Sorry, wasn't thinking clearly, the supercharger is in the usual spot, it's the intercooler that's in the fuel tank area! I'll try get you the pics you asked for soon. I'm sure you can keep the fuel tank, but the rear boot might need to shrink a little.
 
solution

Well half the reason the boot has to be removed is because of the blower. Which isn't as big a deal if you tilt the motor over and convert it to coil packs. Which is what we will do mainly for better weight distribution. The other thing i am going to do is turbo it or replace the blower with a smaller twin screw unit either way solves the issue. We have actually made mounts just interested to see other peoples solutions to problems. I haven't however bolted all the accesories on like the blower etc so i can't comment for certain if it has worked or not. But if it hasn't the s/c will only protrude into the boot less than half an inch and a bulge will surfice.
 
Hi Matt

I think this is the case that proves the rule. It's a great install but where are the post protectors on the battery? For another where are the sensor lines to the fuel float, too?
I can see the tank breather line but where's the filler?

My observation was that no current production car had such a layout, whereas this neat install is clearly an individual's design.
Has to be said though, with it being in the rear of the car, it's likely to be somewhat safer than a front mounted answer.
 
Pottsy, maaaaaate........!!

9151 said:
Next topic please!:thumbsup:
Click to expand...

......didja ever ask Herbie about bunkin' up in his Dormobile, bruvva?

I've missed ya, mate!! Girlie 'n me been swanning around in 'parts unknown' for a cupla weeks!! :sun:

cheers, Ian - NZ
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top