The wife wants me to get the AC going again

autocomman said:
II dont see why you cant get the a/c down to respectable temps with 134a. If it was a good working r-12 system (new to the x19 here) no reason it cant be a good working 134 system. Ive gotten many an American car from the 60's-70's down to low 40's and some into the high 30's.
Mar
Click to expand...

American cars have quite a bit larger and more efficient condensers and typically have better airflow through the condenser. The X condenser lives right above the ground so it gets a of heat radiated off the pavement. 134 needs a larger condenser than R12. The A/C in the X is less than adequate when charged with R12, so going to 134 is something I'd try to avoid if at all possible.
 
TonyK said:
With windows up, not on recirculate and fan on 2nd speed.

When I had a little more charge I had lower temps but the evaporator would freeze up and restrict flow and then the temps would actually rise.

I installed an after market frost switch that I am now playing with to cycle the compressor and melt off the frost. Since the capileri is installed on the gas outlet I have had to reduce the contact of the capilier to allow the compressor to run longer. It was cycling every 3 minutes. Now it rarely comes on and water drips from the pan. This weekend I will increase the charge and see where that gets me. As it stands the cabin is very comfortable in 90 degree temps and humidity to match.

TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada
Click to expand...


Forgive the silly question as i havent seen an x19 system yet...but it has a capilary tube type sensor to shut the compressor off when the evap gets cold enough? GM used a unit just like that that is adjustable...and you can get them also aftermarket that is adjustable for universal appplications...its a calipary tube you clamp to the evap and adjust as necessary. Try looking for one for say a 1978 el camino that may help, i would imagine yours might have an adjustment in it too under a plastic cover or something, to adjust spring tension inside the switch, which will control on and off times
 
Some more information.

Today after work I put on the gauges and took the air temperature.

It is 98 degrees here the high side at 2500 rpm was at 360 PSI the low at 28 PSI, The charge is good, maybe a little high. Idling the engine at the vent temperature was at 58 degrees and going down the road in the hot sun it was 53 degrees.

The 87 X I have does not have a frost sensor, ( I put a set of contacts in the compressor clutch circuit) I installed it on the output line as the Car's Stock system uses the following.

In the low pressure side after the EVAPORATOR is a solenoid that when activated closes and allows hot liquid freon or 134a to now enter the evaporator which is not allow to expand, ( we are now pumping against a dead head) this heats the evaporator and melts the frost. The valve then opens and allows rapid expansion and cooling due to the drop in pressure in the evaporator. The solenoid is activated by a high temperature switch located after the condenser just before the accumulator. The compressor never shuts off through out this cycle. The only thing that shuts off the compressor is the dash switch and the low pressure switch in the system return line located in the engine bay front left corner.

The liquid 134a entering the evaporator expansion valve is hot, adding another section of condenser may improve this, but the stock defrosting system would not work because of lower condenser temperatures.

However seeing a 45 degree drop in temperature for this system with it's long hoses seems pretty good.

TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada.
 
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t seems like ur high side pressure are on the high side....gettting those down by cooling the condenser more or a more efficient condenser would help greatly....but if your happy with it thats ok i guess...if its 90 outside i want 45 in my face lol...but thats just me :)

Also making it a cycling system would keep the evaporator from freezing...it should never really freeze up ever...im curious bout the solonoid tho, gues thats the poor mans way of keeping it from being a cyceling system...which with only 70hp might be noticable when crusing.....but i dunno...guess i gotta wait to get my hands on one to see how it operates and if any improvements can be made

Mark
 
Keep the comments coming, I'm absorbing them.

Around 55 degrees outlet temperature would be good in high 90 weather. The radiator fan was staying on along time (but cycling at least) this week during running around town. So I suspect that the AC would not be on extensively during days when the temperature approaches 100 just because the cooling system would be taxed.

Meanwhile, on the topic of receiver-driers, I found this, which may be of interest to those not doing new hoses....provided the fittings are the same. Appears to have an adapter/coupler for two male hoses.
JaguarReceiverDrierXJ678-81CAC2338.jpg

Even has the stock offset inlet and outlet.
 
Information please

Larry you hold out.

Don't make us beg. Who supplies this part?

What are the fitting sizes? #6 or #8

I will also make the following comment. 134a and the oil used has a tendency to cause the aluminum parts of the A/C system to corrode inside the system. The X system does not use any aluminum components, the fittings are cad plated steel, the evaporator and condenser are both made from copper. Hence my reluctance to change anything to newer aluminum components.

On a 98 degree day 53 degree air blowing out of the vents is....NICE.


TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada.
 
Check page 5-13 of this PDF

Hi Tony,

Did a little digging on the part number. Most places just say CAC2338 is for a Jag Xj6. I finally found this PDF that gives specs on a whole lot of AC parts. Check the top right corner of page 5-13. It has the specs as follows:

Part Number DA-1017-00
Type 3/8 O’Ring
IN 3/8 M.O
OUT 3/8 F.O
Diameter 75 mm
Height 167 mm
Pressure Switch
HP
LP
Application
Jaguar XJ6 4.2 - OE# CAC2338
Click to expand...

Of course it is formatted nicely in the PDF. I wish it was easy to do table layouts i=on Xweb. :(
 
Never mind what was here, lol

EDIT:// I should do more research before I open my big mouth...PAG oil bonds with moisture very easily and is then very corrosive, it will eat the aluminum enough to be pourus to let the small 134a molecule out and causing leaks. Soooo... ya Haha, carry on, and sorry bout the noise ;)
 
Gota look again.

But the X dryer uses 2 female 3/8" or #6 O ring fittings and that is where the problem is, all other dryers use a male and a female fitting.


TonyK

Grimsby Ontario Canada.
 
134a and Moisture.

I learned this the hard way. I purchased a used condenser for my son's 1985 RX7 for $20 installed it and found a crack at the fitting. Removed it, cleaned it and started to TIG weld it. The aluminum had become porous like a sponge due to the corrosion of water and 134a PAG oil. I spent 30 minutes trying to weld that fitting that only kept presenting more porous metal. So, when you look at the X components all steel and copper by today's standards it is unheard of and is repairable if punctured. If I were to increase the condenser I would put in series a small condenser and extend the hoses to make it work. When I remake the hoses on the X which at times have some very complex sections of bent tubing I just crimp on new ferruels. The nut may be a bit rusty, but the inside of the fitting is clean and the plating is bright. So that is why I will caution anyone about taking the car to a repair shop as the fittings will be replaced by aluminum parts which over time again will fail if the system is a bit damp with 134a and PAG oil.

TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada.
 
Great on the Jag drier specs. But I still wonder

it certainly appears from the pictures that the 3/8 male O-ring inlet spec refers to the actual fitting on the drier. Yet the drier as shown and supplied has an adapter that turns that inlet into a female inlet. It could still be a worthy contender. At 22 bucks from Rock Auto it could be worth a shot.
 
A/C

Im in the process of upgradeing My X1/9 with an Vintage Air Compact Mini Unit , I Gutted The old unit which was Junk any way , still have the condenser , reciever Dyer and all the other stuff, As I Remember The original was somewhat worthless, Terrible air Volume , The New unit has electric acuators and can come with Heat, You have you choice of control panels , ck them Out ,
 
Vintage Air is great for vehicles without original AC

But the absence of provision for outside air is a problem on those. And the fitment and adaption of hoses etc make it a whole different can of worms. That said I would use one on a vintage V8 vehicle.
In this case, I simply want to restore what is there to functionality.
 
Dryer

Looking at the PDF Supplied by Mr. Decker

These also look like they would fit the X application, I did not search Rock Auto to see if they have a listing.


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TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada
 
A/C options

Not to detract from your thread, but the suggestion from "BigAl512" is something for all of the non-A/C cars to consider. As a lot (most?) of the pre-Bertone X's were not fitted with A/C, one of the mini-sized retro-fit after-market units could be the way to go. Has anyone done this already? Living in a desert climate puts a whole new meaning on the need for A/C!
We can start a new thread about it. I'm enjoying learning from this thread as well. Thanks.
 
Just FYI

I could not find a way to access this catalog from the company's home page, so it may have been retired. I have no idea if there is any value to the other catalog sections, but I found I could access other parts of the catalog by replacing phrases in the URL with other categories in the right side menu, which isn't active.

For example, replacing the phrase "ReceiverDrier" in the URL with "Evaporator" will bring up the PDF for the various evaporators. Like this:

HTML: 
http://www.acedge.com.sg/catalogue/ACEDGE_ReceiverDrier_Catalogue.pdf

becomes

HTML: 
http://www.acedge.com.sg/catalogue/ACEDGE_Evaporator_Catalogue.pdf

I could not get the expansion valve figured out, but I got these working:

Condensor

Evaporator

Compressor

Fittings
 
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