1603cc engine build

[rjplenter]

I'm curious -was there a seal between the drive gear spindle and the speedo drive housing? Old Volvos used a small top hat seal (kinda like a valve stem seal) for this purpose. I ask 'cos mine appears to be leaking from there. The transducer / transmitter has no seal inside it, and I don't recall if the standard cable end incorporated a seal or not.I have dampness on and around the drive threaded section.

What did you use to extract the drive housing once the retainer bolt was removed? I did try to pull it out by hand, that wasn't happening.

There is a small seal, looks just like a miniature crank or cam seal. I've never seen one of those for sale so I put an O-ring on the shaft then sandwiched a washer between it and the screw cap on the cable, to apply some pressure to the O-ring. After several days there is no oil leak evident.

I couldn't pull the housing out by hand, the new O-ring I put on that recently creates a tight fit. I wrapped tape around the thread and pulled it out with a suitably sized plier.

Cheers,

Rob

 

[lookforjoe]

Thanks, Rob. I did a little searching, and the version Volvo used is still available (#43, 380192), I'll have to get one & try it

 

[dcioccarelli]

Yep, that fixed the leak from the cable drive. There is still a leak, but I haven't had time to get under the car and see where it is coming from.

Cheers,

Rob

Hey Rob,

are we talking about this seal:

http://www.eurosport-uk.net/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=695

http://www.grafe-shop.de/index.php?view=details&productdetails_productid=51742

... or this one?

https://www.midwest-bayless.com/Fia...ive-cable-seal-fiat-all-wmanual-trans-oe.aspx

Cheers,
Dom.

 

[lookforjoe]

Cheers,
Dom.

I meant the inner seal - since mine appears to be seeping around the top and working down, not around the drive base - thanks for the pic - that's different design than the Volvo setup. That one looks like an Volvo BW/AW auto trans selector shaft seal
Curious that it's not shown in the parts breakdown

 

[Rod Midkiff]

It also looks LOT like a GM system. (even the seal looks the same in the pic)

 

[rjplenter]

It looks like I have reduced the gearbox leaks to an acceptable level. I've never seen that seal offered for sale, although I am familiar with Eurosport UK and order from them occasionally. One of the best vendors!

I managed to get some grease into the alternator bearings for now, so it will give me time look at alternative alternators.

Gotta watch those alfa guys... they get so jealous when your engine can outrun theirs and it's 400cc smaller.

Next time your in Oz make sure you repay him the favour!

SteveC

I will! He has offered us his 4C Spider the next time we visit Down Under. Although he says my X handles better than his 4C.

I've already driven his GTA Junior

But what I really want to drive is his SZ

Cheers,

Rob

 

[fiatfactory]

You should see if you can get the SZ to the 1.4G of cornering force they are supposed to be capable of...that would be fair.

While the SZ is a technically very advanced car, the styling has just never appealed to me...the GTA on the other hand I would sell my left testicle for!

SteveC

 

[rjplenter]

You should see if you can get the SZ to the 1.4G of cornering force they are supposed to be capable of...that would be fair.

While the SZ is a technically very advanced car, the styling has just never appealed to me...the GTA on the other hand I would sell my left testicle for!

SteveC

I actually like the SZ styling. Someone recently asked me what my ultimate 20 car garage would be, and the SZ made it into my 20 cars. I should start an Ultimate 20 Car Garage thread in NFC.

The GTA may be for sale soon. If you won the lottery recently I can put you in touch with the owner.

 

[rjplenter]

My lucky wife is driving the X while I'm banned from bending down that far to get in and out! She is enjoying it so much I'm worried I may not get the keys back.

Some updates:

The smaller capacity coolant tank I installed seems to be sufficient. It is possible that the addition of an oil cooler is also helping in this regard. Despite the increased output of the engine, the coolant temperature is staying within a perfect range. Stop/start traffic in hot weather results in the coolant gauge indicating just over 190F.

I know from years of motorsport that stiffening the chassis can yield positive results. I made this strut brace for the engine bay:

It triangulates the strut tops against the firewall and allows for my preferred tall air filters. I think it is working because I am now finding I have a touch of understeer that wasn't there before. I wish I could find a way to stiffen the rest of the chassis, but such is the limitation of a car with a removable roof.

We did have one SNAFU. While out driving we discovered the hard way that the serpentine belt was making contact with the right hand driveshaft on bumpy left hand turns. The result was the X came home (only 5 miles) on a flatbed. Thanks Hagerty!
I have significantly lowered the X, this a restomod remember, and the belt was too close to the driveshaft. Comparing a standard v-belt to the serpentine belt placement, I suspect we would have had a similar issue with a v-belt.

Hussein Holland (clever man!) suggested I reroute the belt up and over the idler pulley and now the problem has been resolved.

It'll soon be time for a filter and oil change and a retune.

Cheers,

Rob

 

[Rupunzell]

More than a few car folks do not appreciate or realize how important chassis stiffness-rigidity is to the overall performance of a motor vehicle. The obsession is often about power with the dynamic behavior of the chassis-suspension neglected to never considered.

Chassis with doors are instantly handicapped for chassis stiffness as these force a low point in the chassis design. The original Lotus Elise design had no doors, the driver-passanger was expected to climb in. Market reality caused doors to be designed into the production version of the Elise, with the chassis engineers complaining-moaning-groaning...

 

[rjplenter]

First oil and filter change completed. All running smoothly

 

[dcioccarelli]

First oil and filter change completed. All running smoothly

Hey Rob,

good to hear! Long time that we haven't heard from you. Hope that everything is going well.

Dom.

 

[rjplenter]

G'day Dom,

Still recovering from spine surgery and I initiated a big expansion project at work. So been busy and limited in mobility at the same time.

Hope you are well.

Cheers,

Rob

 

[lookforjoe]

I've now put a couple of hundred miles on the new engine, retorqued the head and got the carb jetting sorted out. I might tweak the ignition timing a little.

It pulls like a train to 7,000rpm (haven't gone beyond that yet), sounds great, perhaps a slightly deeper note than before. It's very well behaved in traffic and coolant temp is good.

Hey Rob, what are you using to set timing advance, and what level of advance do you have over 6K rpm? At this point, I'm thinking I should start adding timing back up top. As it is, it's pretty flat over 6K. Of course, mine is FI & cam profile is different also..

 

[rjplenter]

Hey Hussein!

I've set ignition timing at idle to 10 degrees BTDC. The Marelli S135 Dizzy I'm using has a max of 28 crank degrees advance, no vacuum, but I don't know any details of it's advance curve specs. Not sure if my idle setting is correct, but with high compression, I don't want to risk over advancing the timing.

Cheers,

Rob

 

[lookforjoe]

Hey Hussein!

I've set ignition timing at idle to 10 degrees BTDC. The Marelli S135 Dizzy I'm using has a max of 28 crank degrees advance, no vacuum, but I don't know any details of it's advance curve specs. Not sure if my idle setting is correct, but with high compression, I don't want to risk over advancing the timing.

Cheers,

Rob

OK - so it's safe to assume that once peak (around 3500 I would expect) is reached, it's capped @ 28ºBTDC. So if yours still pulls well past 6K as opposed to flattening or dropping off, perhaps it is cam profile and cam timing that are giving you the steady pull. I still don't know what the actual load (and therefore actual) & timing values are that I have up top, until I can log that in TunerPro I'll just have to keep it safe. My max timing from about 40% load over 4,6K is 28º and drops to 25º at max load, so I think I'll leave it alone for now.

 

[dcioccarelli]

G'day Dom,

Still recovering from spine surgery and I initiated a big expansion project at work. So been busy and limited in mobility at the same time.

Hope you are well.

Cheers,

Rob

Good to hear that you are recovering!

All good here. On holidays with the family in Calabria: what could be better?

Cheers,
Dom.

 

[rjplenter]

I can log that in TunerPro

I log mine with my buttdyno and grinometer!!!

With my 10º advance at idle, I guess I'm capped at 38º.

My cam timing I know, and I spent considerable time setting it to the prescribed specs. Cam profile, ah, there's black magic there. I was going to spend some time measuring that before I installed it, but then I got excited about getting the engine running.....

Calabria, you're a lucky bloke Dom!

 

[lookforjoe]

I log mine with my buttdyno and grinometer!!!

With my 10º advance at idle, I guess I'm capped at 38º.

My cam timing I know, and I spent considerable time setting it to the prescribed specs. Cam profile, ah, there's black magic there. I was going to spend some time measuring that before I installed it, but then I got excited about getting the engine running.....

Right, I misunderstood the timing total. In that case, I should be able to raise mine up top - with care I'm lower compression than yours at only 10:3.1

 

[fiatfactory]

1603cc engine I've just taken to the dyno for it's first tuning session

Only a few pulls as initially we had a serious lean issue above 4500rpm due to insufficient fuel delivery, so we changed the fuel pump to one with approx 82 litre/hour capacity at 4psi and this solved the fuel delivery problem , car runs a return line, and I have a "redline" style inline fuel pressure regulator to install...but would prefer a "filter king" style filter/reg assembly.

At the moment running the stock Marelli S135 (non vacuum advance) distributor body with a pertronix optical trigger kit. Static set at 10 degrees, mechanical advance is about 28 degrees from memory, so total advance will be 38 and as per stock is all in at about 3500rpm or so... that's one of the things we are going to change. There's another model of Marelli S135xx distributor that uses a 22 degree mechanical advance plate, and we will try the timing at around 15 degrees static...as the low revs response could be improved a little.

These runs were with 32mm venturis, and given the power curve flattens (but doesn't fall away) from about 5600rpm, I think it could use some more air flow, so next are some 34 or 36 venturis I have to try. We also have the 42/44 style bellmouths to fit which will also help with air entry and improve things. On the dyno we had 20 degree ambient temps, but inlet air was 40 degrees, so there could be a decent gain with a cold air box ... but we just ran out of time to try all these things ... the fuel pump not keeping up and the A/F ratio spiking to the 16's above 4k rpm were more important fixes for this first dyno session. the engine is also only just 1000km old, and I built it quite tight, so as it gets more miles and loosens and beds in, power should increase again...

We started with 125 main jets / 220 air correctors, and it was immediately obvious that the engine was needing more fuel. In went some 135's and things improved but the A/F still leaned out around 6k. In went 145's and the A/F was more acceptable all the way to 7500.

But the A/F graph still looks like hilly terrain above 4500rpm too, so there is some sort of air flow harmonic/pulsing going on... as I think the air speed thru the small 32 venturis is very high. Overall happy with the result, and the engine pulls very quickly from 4k to 6500rpm in it's current setup, good enough for the owner ( Mark ) to run up another 1000km before we have another series of dyno pulls.

overall quite happy with the results, I think there's another 20hp at the wheels with this engine once sorted.

SteveC