128SL Coupé winter project

Lowtechprime said:
Great work! 225/45R13 tires will really want 8" wheels though. I had them on 7's but they looked squeezed on, better on an 8"...
Click to expand...
Damn, I just bought the wheels and got them delivered from Italy. Maybe I should look for 205/60R13 instead...
But I see you have 888:s or AR1:s. They are very "square" and would probably look a little bit stretched on a 7" rim as you say. This will be a road car (my X is my racer) and I am looking for something quieter that also works well in rain.
nankang_ns2__.jpg

Did you lower your car by cutting the (front) springs? If so, do you have an idea how much to cut? How much lower will the car become by removing one coil... two coils?
 
Bjorn Nilson said:
First phase of rust repair completed. Many days spent with metal fabrication and welding. The most time-consuming job was fixing the right A-pillar and the doors which were badly rusted out.
View attachment 69382-toeing
I will now continue with fabricating wide wheel arches. I am going for 7" ET 10 CD66 and 195/60 R13 or eventually 225/45 R13 (unfortunately very expensive 😱) so more space is needed. It looks like the car is tip-toeing (see the first pic in this thread) so I believe setting the correct driving height would help a lot before starting up the wheel arch, and front spoiler fabrication. I noticed there is a brand new thread about lowering the 128 that I will follow with interest.
Today I removed the front springs to get an idea of how low I should go.
Below is the standard strut bottom-out point which is about the new driving height that I am aiming for. I also noticed that much more camber is needed which might be difficult to obtain.
MOMO 5,5" with 185/60 R13 for testing:
View attachment 69384
Click to expand...
Again, more nice work!

In my opinion that last pic of the car's ride height (I think you said that's with the struts collapsed?), is still a little too high. Especially once you widen the fenders.

You will want to retain a decent amount of suspension travel, as Carl noted. So shorter overall struts will be needed. I believe the X's struts are shorter than the 128's? But even better will be to find or make customs ones with several features: short enough to get as low as you want but still offer good travel, and adjustments for dampening, ride height, spring tension, and camber.
 
Bjorn Nilson said:
Damn, I just bought the wheels and got them delivered from Italy. Maybe I should look for 205/60R13 instead...
But I see you have 888:s or AR1:s. They are very "square" and would probably look a little bit stretched on a 7" rim as you say. This will be a road car (my X is my racer) and I am looking for something quieter that also works well in rain.
View attachment 69387
Did you lower your car by cutting the (front) springs? If so, do you have an idea how much to cut? How much lower will the car become by removing one coil... two coils?
Click to expand...
They were already cut when I got it, I don't have stock springs to compare them to. I further lowered it with a modified 127 strut... I have found the R888's and the AR-1's are pretty good in the rain, no good for the cold though you being in Sweden...
 
Last edited:
Bjorn Nilson said:
First phase of rust repair completed. Many days spent with metal fabrication and welding. The most time-consuming job was fixing the right A-pillar and the doors which were badly rusted out.
View attachment 69382-toeing
I will now continue with fabricating wide wheel arches. I am going for 7" ET 10 CD66 and 195/60 R13 or eventually 225/45 R13 (unfortunately very expensive 😱) so more space is needed. It looks like the car is tip-toeing (see the first pic in this thread) so I believe setting the correct driving height would help a lot before starting up the wheel arch, and front spoiler fabrication. I noticed there is a brand new thread about lowering the 128 that I will follow with interest.
Today I removed the front springs to get an idea of how low I should go.
Below is the standard strut bottom-out point which is about the new driving height that I am aiming for. I also noticed that much more camber is needed which might be difficult to obtain.
MOMO 5,5" with 185/60 R13 for testing:
View attachment 69384
Click to expand...
That is definitely as low as I would go. I am under no illusions around having no suspension travel, Fiats were designed for large amounts of suspension movement to deliver all of what they can. To me taking that away loses what makes driving a Fiat special. I don’t care to be beaten up by my car.

102AC19E-7126-48A0-B365-03AC5B2A69FD.jpeg
 
I have 205/60/13s on 8" rims on my redX and the rims are probably too wide for that size tire as there is a mild stretch look to the tires.
 
carl said:
I have 205/60/13s on 8" rims on my redX and the rims are probably too wide for that size tire as there is a mild stretch look to the tires.
Click to expand...
Pic for illustrative/comparative purposes?🙏

205/60 will be almost 2" in diameter larger than 225/45, so that's a pretty big difference! 22.7" vs 20.9"...
185/60 is in the middle at 21.7" but almost an inch narrower.....
 
Last edited:
kmead said:
That is definitely as low as I would go. I am under no illusions around having no suspension travel, Fiats were designed for large amounts of suspension movement to deliver all of what they can. To me taking that away loses what makes driving a Fiat special. I don’t care to be beaten up by my car.

View attachment 69388
Click to expand...
Hey! Just so you know.. Maybe the 128 is different from the X in that regard? As low as my car currently is, it never bottoms out. The springs are still more or less stock firmness so the ride is still pretty soft(softer than I'd like) But reduced travel hasn't been an issue 😁

I did use the slotted 127 struts up front though that have a much lower spring perch, so travel is still stock 127, and I slightly shortened the rear bump stops on a belt sander...
 
The amount of available travel does not necessarily relate directly to the ride height...depending on the struts, dampeners, other suspension components, settings, etc. Yes, a lowered bone stock system will reduce travel, but that is why we modify things. :)
 
carl said:
I have 205/60/13s on 8" rims on my redX and the rims are probably too wide for that size tire as there is a mild stretch look to the tires.
Click to expand...
Yes, but I assume they would fit good on my 7" CD66. It is also a matter of what kind of tire you have. On the X I have Semi Slicks 185/60R13 on 6" rims and they are perfect but close to rubbing as they are very squared. I had Yokohama (street) 185/60R13 on the X before and they are narrower.
I cannot decide what to buy. The 225/45R13 are probably too wide, 205/60R13 would be perfect but only available as Semi Slicks, and I am afraid 195/60R13 (street tire) will look stretched.
When I ordered the CD66 7" rims I had this picture in mind.
16.jpg

This car has 205/60R13 and I think they are just about right. This car has about the same height as mine (see pic below), but I will build the arches differently. Maybe I even put spacers on it to make it a little bit wider.
Lowtechprime said:
Hey! Just so you know.. Maybe the 128 is different from the X in that regard? As low as my car currently is, it never bottoms out. The springs are still more or less stock firmness so the ride is still pretty soft(softer than I'd like) But reduced travel hasn't been an issue 😁
Click to expand...
Yes the 128 differs from X1/9. The suspension travel is longer in the front. If I shorten the bottom out tube at this ride height, there will still be 100-120mm suspension travel:
IMG_20230104_171544.jpg

My X is on winter storage so I cannot compare, but from memory I don't have that much suspension travel (with coilovers) in the front on the X, and it never bottoms out.
 
Lowtechprime said:
Hey! Just so you know.. Maybe the 128 is different from the X in that regard? As low as my car currently is, it never bottoms out. The springs are still more or less stock firmness so the ride is still pretty soft(softer than I'd like) But reduced travel hasn't been an issue 😁

I did use the slotted 127 struts up front though that have a much lower spring perch, so travel is still stock 127, and I slightly shortened the rear bump stops on a belt sander...
Click to expand...
There is an intersection on my regular route home which will fully compress and fully extend the suspension of every car I own at the speed limit for that road, it isn’t one like you have in CA where its contoured for drainage, its just the configuration of the height changes. Some of my cars take that better than others, the Miata with its limited travel being the worst.

In my state we have had one political party in power for four decades and among the things they have actively not spent money on is infrastructure. It shows. Fix the damn roads…
 
I mentioned the loss of suspension travel above only to remind folks that it is a consideration when lowering our Fiats. I never had an issue with my cheaply lowered 128s and SLs. I did have a problem with my spiders when I lowered them to what looked cool but made the car almost dangerous to drive on our crappy roads. I have a problem with the coilovers on the Fatrat because the shock body is too tall and if you lower the car you use up too much travel. They also have solid top mounts which readily let you know when you have bottomed out.

I laugh at lowered Miatas as they had very little suspension travel from the factory and lowering them made them useless.

Apparently California (and us northern Virginia) drivers should be turning our Fiats into rally replicas with extended suspension travel.
 
I know a young guy that is still in college and therefore has little funds for his car hobby. He likes old VW's and drives a Mk1 (water cooled). Just like the X they tend to ride a bit high in stock trim, and as Carl says if you simply lower the stock suspension a lot you will run out of travel. But he really wanted a low ride so he literally removed the springs and runs only on the bump-stops. Obviously it isn't good but he is willing to live with going slow, avoiding large bumps, and feeling the "pogostick" ride. It's funny to watch him driving along bouncing around inside his car. Apology to Bjorn for getting off topic. :confused:
 
If you're going to build a low rider don't pick a 128. This car has many limitations for going low. I must say that the X is much easier to make lower and is a much better candidate to become a race car. I have no plans to race the 128 but if I had I would certainly rebuild the rear suspension and put coilovers in all four corners.
I think at least 100-120mm of suspension travel is necessary on Swedish roads so today I checked how low I can go with stock struts.
IMG_20230106_180626.jpg

Not very impressing I think, but this is as low I can go if maintaining reasonable suspension travel.
As you see there's not much space left, and I need to re-shape the leaf-spring, sand down the rubber cone AND add distances to attach the leaf-spring in a lower position
IMG_20230106_180709.jpg

Next I will order the (street) tires (Nankang Sportnex NS-2 195/60R13) to see how they'll fit and eventually adjust ET with spacers.
 
Lowtechprime said:
You can still get Toyo RA 1's in 205/60R13... That is an awesome grippy, long lasting rain worthy tire...
Click to expand...
Yes, I know. I have Nankang AR1 185/60R13 on the X and I am very happy with them. They work reasonably well in rain but they are noisy. I would like to try fit the 195/60 but there are costs and efforts to send them back if they turn out not to fit as expected. I will try a Yokohama 185/60 on the CD66 to see how that looks. (I have that tire on a 5,5" rim on the front wheel in the pic above). -it is just 10mm narrower than 195/60 so it might give me a clue about what it would look like. But first I need to get the ride height and camber somewhat correct.
 
Oddly enough, I never felt the need to lower my SL, it seemed to me the factory got it right. 128 sedan, Xs and 124s not so much.
 
Bjorn Nilson said:
Yes, I know. I have Nankang AR1 185/60R13 on the X and I am very happy with them. They work reasonably well in rain but they are noisy. I would like to try fit the 195/60 but there are costs and efforts to send them back if they turn out not to fit as expected. I will try a Yokohama 185/60 on the CD66 to see how that looks. (I have that tire on a 5,5" rim on the front wheel in the pic above). -it is just 10mm narrower than 195/60 so it might give me a clue about what it would look like. But first I need to get the ride height and camber somewhat correct.
Click to expand...
Hmmm... I didn't think my hearing was bad, but I don't think I've ever 'heard' my tires over the engine noise or the radio... I think the only time I did was when I briefly had an Xterra with some fairly aggressive knobby's....🙉
I'm probably not the best barometer for this issue though as I've also never noticed a difference in road noise when switching from rubber bushings to delrin or spherical jointed suspension..🤷
It's not like a '70's Fiat is the same as a modern land yacht, with 12" thick insulated, airbagged body panels and no visibility... It's never going to be quiet like one of those things ....
 
Last edited:
Yeah. You're right the car is so damn noisy in general so who cares about a little extra road noice. 205/60R13 R-tires it will be. They look the best and the bigger circumference will reduce the engine revs a little bit as well.
 
Got Toyo R888R 205/60 R13 on and they fit well. But there's too much camber at the rear and too less camber at the front so I need to re-slot the struts a little bit to adjust. I removed 2¼ coils from the front springs and that is as far as I could go to keep 100-120mm suspension travel. Waiting for having the rear leaf spring re-arced/lowered by 35-40mm but will simulate the weight of a full fuel tank and measure one more time to be 100% sure I'll get the ride height the way I want it before I go to the suspension specialist.
Another couple of days are needed for rust repair, then time for building fender flares.
IMG_20230123_191119.jpg
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top