Alignment settings for street/occasional track use

Isotope9

Isotope9

Daily Driver
So I've replaced the shocks/springs all round, and the bushings in the front end (rears were new) and now I need an alignment.

To that end, can someone please let me know what the stock ride height is? I'm going to lower the car a tad (1/4 to 1/2in...not looking to join stance nation) and I want to return it to stock before adjusting the ride height.

Also, does anyone have recommended alignment settings for mostly street driven, occasional track day use? I have the stock ones from the service manual, but was wondering if there are some proven settings out there. My only other experience with other than factory alignment settings is on my gutted Integra track car with an extremely stiff rear end/huge roll-bar...so I don't think they would apply here.

Thanks in advance,
Rob
 
Isotope9 said:
To that end, can someone please let me know what the stock ride height is? I'm going to lower the car a tad (1/4 to 1/2in...not looking to join stance nation) and I want to return it to stock before adjusting the ride height.
Click to expand...

Rob, I think you have that backwards. Adjusting the ride height will alter the camber and toe settings. You want to establish ride height before you do the alignment, not after.

Pete
 
Thanks Pete...perhaps I wasn't clear in my initial post. I'm going to set the ride height back to stock, drop it 1/4-1/2 in, THEN take it for an alignment based on (hopefully) some well accepted settings from other members.

I am aware that changing the ride height will also change camber/toe etc.
 
Dial in as much caster as you're able. That greatly helps with the feeling of stability. It can make turning a little harder but with so little weight on the front I haven't ever noticed a difference.
 
When starting to adjust away from the factory settings it can end up like trying to balance a wobbly table by hacking at the legs, unless you have a clear idea of where you are trying to get to. From my experiences setting up a car for UK hillclimbs I found that im not far off standard camber and toe to get the responses I need, car manufacturers do a lot of research. However, that did require adjustable top mounts as the car is not totally square, no accident damage but I think from manufacture. The rest of the setup is not standard. The suspension is way stiffer than standard, coilovers, a good bit lower, with much wider track & tyres and a small rear sway bar.
Having gone that far (and spent many ££) I have a X1/9 that makes the handling of a standard version look like a wheelbarrow, but its horrible on anything other than smooth roads. :)
 
speedy fiat said:
When starting to adjust away from the factory settings it can end up like trying to balance a wobbly table by hacking at the legs, unless you have a clear idea of where you are trying to get to. From my experiences setting up a car for UK hillclimbs I found that im not far off standard camber and toe to get the responses I need, car manufacturers do a lot of research. However, that did require adjustable top mounts as the car is not totally square, no accident damage but I think from manufacture. The rest of the setup is not standard. The suspension is way stiffer than standard, coilovers, a good bit lower, with much wider track & tyres and a small rear sway bar.
Having gone that far (and spent many ££) I have a X1/9 that makes the handling of a standard version look like a wheelbarrow, but its horrible on anything other than smooth roads. :)
Click to expand...

Thanks for the input, and I know what you mean about going too far. My track car (which is FWD) has a rock hard rear suspension with a 24mm sway bar, nearly solid engine and trans mounts and even the smallest imperfections at low speed feels like I'm driving off a curb...however, the faster I go, the smoother it gets.
 
It would help to know what your springs and shocks are, as well as tires. And as already noted, set the ride height first. For a street car, don't lower the car to the point that the control arms are past parallel to the ground.

A simple street/track setup is:

Caster: +5.5~6 degrees.
Front Camber: -1.5~1.75
Front Toe (total): 1/8th inch toe-in.

Rear Camber: -2 ~ 2.5
Rear Toe (total): 1/8th inch toe-in.
 
For my car the caster is as standard as I have no way of adjusting that (or do I ??) . Camber and toe-in are as Steve's. The coilovers are Avo's, they work okay but need a lot fettling to get an acceptable camber. Tyres are 205/60 13's alround. The spring rates are 475 rear and 275 front according to my records, they may be a notch up or down as I may have changed them late last season and not written it down. The hieght to the bottom of the doors is around 26cm with a slight bias towards a lower front end. The wheel arch extensions make a more usual comparison measurement pointless
 
speedy fiat said:
For my car the caster is as standard as I have no way of adjusting that (or do I ??) .
Click to expand...

I believe that's what the shims at the front end of the radius rods are for.

speedy fiat said:
The wheel arch extensions make a more usual comparison measurement pointless
Click to expand...

Honestly, I think that measuring "stock" ride height is pretty pointless now, with this method or others. Even on a completely stock car, the newest springs out there are 32 years old now. You can bet they have sagged a very measurable amount in that time.

Pete
 
An excellent book for those wishing to study the basic principles of setting car up is "The sports car & kit car suspension & brakes high performance manual" by Des Hammill. Published by "Veloce books".
 
Steve Hoelscher said:
It would help to know what your springs and shocks are, as well as tires. And as already noted, set the ride height first. For a street car, don't lower the car to the point that the control arms are past parallel to the ground.

A simple street/track setup is:

Caster: +5.5~6 degrees.
Front Camber: -1.5~1.75
Front Toe (total): 1/8th inch toe-in.

Rear Camber: -2 ~ 2.5
Rear Toe (total): 1/8th inch toe-in.
Click to expand...


Thanks Steve! Springs/shocks are the non-adjustable shock Vick's Hydrasports with the sport performance springs (225f/275r) Tires are 195/45/15 Kumho Ecsta Supras.
 
OK. So you have a lower profile tire. That means camber is a more significant variable. For track performance you want the camber set more aggressively than for street. The more negative front camber the more the car will want to follow pavement imperfections and the more easily you will lock the front brakes.

Your springs are pretty soft so the car will have a lot of body roll when cornering on track. So more negative camber helps keep the contact patch flat to improve grip and reduce wear on the outside shoulder.

Caster is indeed adjustable. You can add or remove washers or shims behind the cup washer that retains the radius arm bushing. The factory spec for caster is about 6 degrees. That's way more than is typical. It does indeed improve straight line stability. It also add "camber gain" as you turn the wheel.

There are a number of good books on basic suspension tuning and setup. I have read the vast majority and written on the subject myself. If anyone has any questions or would like to discuss any aspects of suspension or setup you are welcome to start a thread.
 
Steve Hoelscher said:
OK. So you have a lower profile tire. That means camber is a more significant variable. For track performance you want the camber set more aggressively than for street. The more negative front camber the more the car will want to follow pavement imperfections and the more easily you will lock the front brakes.

Your springs are pretty soft so the car will have a lot of body roll when cornering on track. So more negative camber helps keep the contact patch flat to improve grip and reduce wear on the outside shoulder.

Caster is indeed adjustable. You can add or remove washers or shims behind the cup washer that retains the radius arm bushing. The factory spec for caster is about 6 degrees. That's way more than is typical. It does indeed improve straight line stability. It also add "camber gain" as you turn the wheel.

There are a number of good books on basic suspension tuning and setup. I have read the vast majority and written on the subject myself. If anyone has any questions or would like to discuss any aspects of suspension or setup you are welcome to start a thread.
Click to expand...
I would love to get some pointers on set-up for a road racer. Limited usefulness for most here, but perhaps an interesting point of comparison?
 
Finally got around to getting the alignment done and what a difference! The car doesn't alternate between trying to dive into oncoming traffic or understeer off the road. I should get my eyes checked though, as my eyeball alignment settings resulted in -3 to -3.5 degree range camber front and rear and approx 1.7 degree toe in the front.

Only issue now, is that when I took the wife out for a spin, coolant was leaking from the heater box. A quick search of the forum seems to point to the heater valve as the likely culprit (although I haven't take a good look yet), so it may be something else, but it looks like the car will be out of action until I get that sorted.

Thanks again for everyone's help.
 
Preparing my X for street and track with AVO adjustable coil overs. Front camber adjustment is via camber bolts while rear is via slot on the strut lower mount. Can you please clarify the camber angles you mention in your post. Minus 3.5 degrees camber seems rather excessive. Also, do you have a reading for rear toe-in? Thx.
 
Alain said:
Preparing my X for street and track with AVO adjustable coil overs. Front camber adjustment is via camber bolts while rear is via slot on the strut lower mount. Can you please clarify the camber angles you mention in your post. Minus 3.5 degrees camber seems rather excessive. Also, do you have a reading for rear toe-in? Thx.
Click to expand...

I am using Steve's suggested settings and am very satisfied, both on the street and on the track, as stated in post 10 in this thread. I made one slight change, setting the front and rear toe at 0. It handles very well, but always goes where I point it, with no self centering. I am going to set it to 1/8 total as Steve recommends, as it takes a lot of attention to drive it as it is.

The part that rarely gets mentioned, is that changing any one of the 3 settings changes the others. For me it is a bit of dance to get them all spot on.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top