Better rust protection in 80's models?

M

MarkyMark1

New Member
I'm looking to buy an X1/9. It's my understanding that rust protection got better in ~1984 but can't find useful details. How did it get better? How much better did it get? Is it worth paying a bit of a premium for later model cars? Any useful websites you could point me to for more info? How much rust is too much rust (is that even a real question)?
 
I wouldn't discount earlier cars either - if they were well kept, they probably won't have much rust (depends on where you're looking to buy!)

My car is an '82, was after market rust proofed when new and it still wears its original paint. While the rockers are road rashed (paint is worn) - there is no rust. The pinch weld along the bottom is solid, trunk floors are mint, and behind the wheels are great. My car doesn't get washed with water (I use waterless wash) - but the only part that does have some issues are the strut towers - they're made up of several layers of steel - and I guess e-coating didn't flow in there very well. That's something I'll have to fix when I have the engine out. Not structural in my case, but I want it to look good. The fronts rust as well for the same reason :( - so have a look in those areas on any car that you're looking at. My car isn't perfect - but I do drive it. She has 190K kms on her now, engine has never been apart other than a different cam. (head stayed on)

Even later cars do rust if they weren't cared for.

Plenty of good examples out there, prices reflect that - but really worth it in my opinion!

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Here is a thread on the topic. The best advice I can give you is to find the best body you can, regardless of model year. The mechanicals can be replaced much cheaper than a rusted out body.

I have a 78X that is about 96% rust free. It was one owner CA car up until 2003 when I had it shipped to MO. There are nice early cars out there to be found, but the late model cars have the advantage of being up to 10 years newer. :)
 
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Have a look at the Bertone/IAI brochure. The rustproofing and paint coverage got much better. A later car in general will have less rust in all the bad places than the earlier cars. They will still rust without doubt so finding a car with little rust is important.

There is a huge difference between surface rust and rust through. The early gold car asked about last week had minor surface rust evident in the pics shown, rust like that is not why you would reject a car.

Some surface crusty rust on heavy gauge steel brackets and suspension components is also not a reason to reject a car.

Areas you want to look at very carefully are the floor and vertical walls of the front trunk as it goes up towards the strut towers (seeing small raised areas of rust in that area is a harbinger of real work to come), around the windshield base and up the A pillars, the pockets forward of the rear struts, the walls of the rear strut towers and of course the rockers. The rear crossmember where the lower A arms attach can be very difficult to repair and is somewhat prone to some rust, we have seen a number of cars with terminal rust in that area that folks have fixed with some significant welding and fabrication. All of these are difficult to repair and will take a lot of work. Often not economical unless you have tools and skills.

Areas that will rust but are much less concerning are the floors which can be cut out and welded in new and the rear trunk floor. These often rust due to trapped water or the heat from the exhaust in combination with the fiberglass insulation holding water which then rusts the steel it is up against. In general a fairly easy fix.

An area you often see rust is behind the rear wheels into the trunk at the bottom corners. This rust is non structural but highly visible. It is a pain to fix but can be done in a variety of ways. This also results from the same issues as the trunk floor but also has a poor design which held water in the bottom in concert with a number of poorly sealed trim holes for the rear elephant ears.

Doors rust but can be replaced complete. There is also an area that rusts in the door opening where a plastic plug goes to hold the door seal in place. This is another area which is hard to fix and is visible each time you open the door.

Anyway, the moral of the story is get the least rusty car you can find and fix anything that is getting started. A non rusty car with questionable mechanicals is much better than a crusty car with great mechanicals. You can easily fix or replace a mechanical part, fixing the body is much more difficult and the repair panels are few and far between. Paint is expensive.

And I love Myron’s orange red car, such a great color and rarely seen.
 
There were improvements in the 83 models when Bertone took over with extra holes added in windscreen pillars etc for more of the undercoat to get in and penetrate - this was documented in a press release at the time which all the little changes made its been posted here before

then i believe in 84-85 there were improvements in the whole rust proof process (which is mentioned on later Bertone brochures) which as a result of the Volvo Coupe being produced and Volvo wanting Bertone to upgrade to a modern standard at the time for the Volvo cars which upgraded the x19 also

So definitely the later Bertone were better protected at the factory but this didnt stop at times cars sitting outside in the Turin heat or snow either half built or waiting to be shipped round the world (Henks book shows this clearly) and of course after that it all depends how car was looked after ie stored indoor / outdoors and if it was exposed to salty roads or wet conditions
 
I've found later cars that spent their lives in "rust free" areas but still had a ton of rust, and earlier cars that spent their lives in "heavy rust" areas but had very little rust. Many variables at play. So I'd say look carefully at any car that claims to have no rust - regardless of where it comes from or what year it is. I can assure you there will be some rust somewhere on every old Fiat. It might be hidden in between layers or inside cavities where you won't see it, and it may not be heavy, but there will be some rust on every single one...no matter what.
 
myronx19 said:
I wouldn't discount earlier cars either - if they were well kept, they probably won't have much rust (depends on where you're looking to buy!)

My car is an '82, was after market rust proofed when new and it still wears its original paint. While the rockers are road rashed (paint is worn) - there is no rust. The pinch weld along the bottom is solid, trunk floors are mint, and behind the wheels are great. My car doesn't get washed with water (I use waterless wash) - but the only part that does have some issues are the strut towers - they're made up of several layers of steel - and I guess e-coating didn't flow in there very well. That's something I'll have to fix when I have the engine out. Not structural in my case, but I want it to look good. The fronts rust as well for the same reason :( - so have a look in those areas on any car that you're looking at. My car isn't perfect - but I do drive it. She has 190K kms on her now, engine has never been apart other than a different cam. (head stayed on)

Even later cars do rust if they weren't cared for.

Plenty of good examples out there, prices reflect that - but really worth it in my opinion!

View attachment 50623
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Interesting question: how do you wash the underside of an Exxe? I wouldn’t dare take it through a car wash for fear of leaks above the doors.
 
Bertone also switch to an electro-static painting method which improved coverage into hard to reach areas. This help assure hidden areas were getting a coat of paint, at least better then earlier cars.
 
tvmaster said:
Interesting question: how do you wash the underside of an Exxe? I wouldn’t dare take it through a car wash for fear of leaks above the doors.
Click to expand...
No car should go through a car wash.

Using a self directed high pressure hose allows you to not direct it at the joint of the roof and the glass. I use a pressure washer all the time on all my cars.

I wash the underside by driving up on ramps and lifting the rear and putting it on jack stands
 
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