Fiat 500 Abarth Brakes installed on X1/9

Ok, so do we have actual information showing that there was a 500 available anywhere in the workd that did in fact have 240mm vented front rotors?
 
This is from the Bendix catalog. The first chart shows the NA part numbers and the second chart shows the rotor information. The BPR number is for a premium rotor the PRT is the standard part. Not many choices in the US. I will try to find the Bendix catalog for Europe (England) which should show many more choices given the number of models and the variety across the Fiat group (Alfa, Fiat etc)
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Looking at those charts (thanks Special K), the smallest vented rotor is 257mm (10 7/64"), P/N: 6122 [the chart says radius but those are diameters]. That's all 2012 through 2017 non-Abarth / Turbo / Electric models.

That would explain why the part numbers I found earlier came up as 257mm when Ulix looked them up over there.

I guess the good news is Tony K has confirmed that is what he has mounted on the X1/9, with Abarth calipers to allow it to align correctly. So 257mm works, just not sure how this whole package fits under different wheel sizes.
 
Pagid has a great site for looking at calipers, rotors and so on.

This is the Fiat section

https://www.brakebook.com/bb/pagid/en_GB/PKW/35/applicationSearch.xhtml

Good info on dimensions, simple pics and some drawings.

Largest 4 lug disc I found was this one off a 2.0 D Bravo (may have been a Brava)
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This is the disc for an Uno 1.3 Turbo. This in combo with a 1.3 D 500 Caliper with caliper carrier should net a X front caliper and rotor combo that would allow 13” rims.
456DC2D9-1D18-4CCF-B45C-C6D44043971F.png
 
Ulix said:
Ok, so do we have actual information showing that there was a 500 available anywhere in the workd that did in fact have 240mm vented front rotors?
Click to expand...

The 1.3D Multijet 500 had a 240mm vented rotor
EC354935-4078-47C5-9B9E-373D7E4B31A6.png
 
These images (thanks again Karl) help to show another critical dimension that needs to be considered when putting together something like we are talking about - mix and match calipers, rotors, and vehicles. I refer to it as the "offset", not sure if that is the correct technical term. But it determines if the rotor will be centered in between the brake pads when it is all assembled. Look at the circled dimension for each illustration, the 240mm and 281mm rotors. That dimension can be different for any rotor regardless of the diameter; it has to do with the design of the vehicle's spindle assembly.
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You can accomodate for it to some extent by adding shims between the caliper bracket and the spindle, assuming the offset needs to be moved in that direction. If it is the other direction then something will need to be machined.
If building a adapter bracket to enable mounting of a caliper that is not a "bolt on" fit, then the thickness of the adapter will also affect this offset distance. It can get a little complicated to calculate unless you have lots of good technical drawings or have the components in your hands to measure.
 
I would like to upgrade my brakes. Can someone summarise which type of brakes I have to search in Europe? Plenty of used fiat parts available, but I have to know where to look for :)
 
Martijn, I think there is some uncertainty about the actual components in your case (being in Europe), due to the US spec Abarth having different brakes. For that matter, I'm still not certain we know the correct components in the US because I do not know if Tony's parts from Canada are US spec or Euro spec. But generally speaking it seems to be the Abarth calipers/hanger bracket and standard 500 rotors. Can anyone confirm if the Canadian Abarth brakes are the same as the US spec or Euro spec ones?
 
I would look at getting parts from an early 500 1.3D caliper (2008 vintage) with either the rotors for that application or the 1.3 Uno Turbo and the calipers from the 1.3D.

I don’t know if there are junk yards you could get junky parts from to verify fit and then get new parts for actually driving around.

But as has been said, none of these parts are available in the US so we don’t have access to try them without spending some healthy money to find out.
 
Martijn,
What size wheels are you using? This will affect what size brakes you can fit.
As you are in europe....
13" Wheels, you could look for some Uno turbo calipers and 240mm vented discs on the front and fiat 132/FSO 38mm rear calipers and standard discs on rear.
14" Wheels, look for Punto GT front calipers and 257mm vented discs and the same 132 38mm rears.
Note the Uno calipers have 48mm pistons the same as the X1/9 calipers but the Punto calipers have 54mm pistons. The larger pistons will give you a slightly "longer pedal" as the master cylinder needs to move more fluid to make the piston move the same distance.
Regards
Andy
 
kmead said:
an early 500 1.3D caliper
Click to expand...
I'm not certain what "500 1.3D" translates to in US spec, but as I understood Tony's experience the calipers had to be the Abarth spec to fit correctly...the "standard" calipers had a different offset requiring machine work to make them fit. But maybe the Abarth calipers are the same as 1.3D?

This brings up another question I've had. Is it just the 'carrier' (caliper mount, pad holder) that has to be Abarth, or the entire caliper assembly? Another way to ask what I'm trying to say is, are the calipers themselves interchangeable between Abarth and standard aside from the carriers? I suspect not; the Abarth caliper may have a larger piston and different bolt pattern to the carrier. But wonder if maybe they just changed the carrier to compensate for the larger rotor on the Abarth, and the actual caliper half is the same?
 
However that is my point. Tony found that a specific combination of caliper from one model and rotor from another model was what fit. I got the impression that using the caliper from a standard model (1.3D ?) will not line up correctly. The thing I'm not certain about is how those models translate to other countries (or between Canada and the US for that matter).
 
Agreed, thus getting some parts and trying it out. There are several 240mm rotors just in the Fiat part of the catalog, one could also look at VW rotors at 239mm and drill them for 98mm as another alternative.

Churning through the Pagid catalog could be a worthwhile activity.

To your other point, the caliper carriers are the other wild card which can have a big effect on the overall geometry of all the parts coming together with a safe solution.
 
As many of you know I installed Uno Turbo Brakes on my 79 X just like others on this form have done. On the down side of this upgrade is having parts when you need them and I didn't have any spares. I kept putting off purchasing a new set of rotors and pads to keep on the shelf in my basement. So last week I said enough is enough and ordered a set of pads and brakes from the UK ebay. As always, shipping was the killer and worked out to about $80 USD. The box arrived today shipped by DHL and I had to pay another $40 USD for import and taxes. So the total for 2 rotors and a set of brake pads comes to $313 USD or $423 CND. A bit steep in my mind, but I am there now and have to live with it.

Here are a few pictures.

TonyK.

Grimsby Ontario Canada.

IMG_1269.JPG
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IMG_1271.JPG
 
$400. I don't know the typical Canadian expression for "holly ****", but whatever it is I just said it.
 
lidox19 said:
Martijn,
What size wheels are you using? This will affect what size brakes you can fit.
As you are in europe....
13" Wheels, you could look for some Uno turbo calipers and 240mm vented discs on the front and fiat 132/FSO 38mm rear calipers and standard discs on rear.
14" Wheels, look for Punto GT front calipers and 257mm vented discs and the same 132 38mm rears.
Note the Uno calipers have 48mm pistons the same as the X1/9 calipers but the Punto calipers have 54mm pistons. The larger pistons will give you a slightly "longer pedal" as the master cylinder needs to move more fluid to make the piston move the same distance.
Regards
Andy
Click to expand...

I have 15 inch wheels. So that should work uno turbo is also getting rare and expensive here. Punto gt is maybe a good option. Ths 38 mm rear calipers are also very hard to get.
 
FWIW, 500 Abarth calipers are also installed on any 2012-2018 500 north american model with the 1.4 multiair turbo engine, so if you are junkyard shopping, look for a 500 with a turbo motor and you are golden.
 
zonker said:
500 Abarth calipers are also installed on any 2012-2018 500 north american model with the 1.4 multiair turbo engine
Click to expand...
That is what it looked like when I checked parts listings but I wasn't sure, thanks. And there is a big price difference between the Abarth ones and the standard ones. Do you know if it is just the mounting bracket (pad carrier) that is different or the entire caliper?
 
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