racing?
- Thread starter dburdick
- Start date
depends on where you want to play.
SCCA, NASA, or other.
Solo 1 / Solo 2 / road racing.
SCCA, NASA, or other.
Solo 1 / Solo 2 / road racing.
dburdick
doug b
Checked the scc
a website and in the part where it says what can I do with my car, it ask for the year, which only goes back as far as 1980. So, is vintage racing what I want? I thought maybe solo 1.
a website and in the part where it says what can I do with my car, it ask for the year, which only goes back as far as 1980. So, is vintage racing what I want? I thought maybe solo 1.
No scorps in my garage (regretfully)
Me:
I run with Highlands Sports Car Club http://highlandssportscarclub.com/
and Central Carolinas Region SCCA http://www.ccrscca.com/solo-racing/
Clemson is running an active Sports Car Club as well.
http://www.ccrscca.com/solo-racing/
and Atlanta Region SCCA is hosting national level autocrosses
http://www.atlantascca.org/
There is a SC Region SCCA, but do not know much about their events
http://www.scsportscar.com/
and good news for the x-1/9 is that the x is finally listed in the 2013 draft rules in FSP..... :headbang:
Me:
I run with Highlands Sports Car Club http://highlandssportscarclub.com/
and Central Carolinas Region SCCA http://www.ccrscca.com/solo-racing/
Clemson is running an active Sports Car Club as well.
http://www.ccrscca.com/solo-racing/
and Atlanta Region SCCA is hosting national level autocrosses
http://www.atlantascca.org/
There is a SC Region SCCA, but do not know much about their events
http://www.scsportscar.com/
and good news for the x-1/9 is that the x is finally listed in the 2013 draft rules in FSP..... :headbang:
BEEK
True Classic
the main issue i have with "club racing" is i have competed for years wheel to wheel in nascar, arca and fascar. for those who are interested i did race a fiat 124 coupe in nascar weekly racing series. but back to my story. Club racing involves racing against a clock, not saying all but solo type and such. i prefer wheel to wheel action, and have no intentions of hitting another car. not my style. im looking into NASA, as they seem to have an open competition class for every vehicle, you might not have the fastest or even be competitive in your class, but you can take anything and race. and for me building the car is almost more fun that driving it.
Dallarax19
Builder -Dallara Replica
Just do this and be done....
http://www.carolinamotorsportspark.com/turn1.html
**I presume the 2013 schedule will be out soon
No politics and real time in the seat. If you truly desire racing experience then Solo 1 and Solo 2 won't cut it. Unless you have an unlimited budget then go for spec racing like the Miata or BMW class if you must rub paint and accumulate points. I could not believe the politics in SCCA however buddies that have run NASA events have been happy. My recommendation is to run track days - three tracks within 2 hrs for me so somewhat easy for me to say. Get in a group with your skill set and dice it out. I have found that to be the most fun and economical and you can run your car in any configuration providing it "safe" to drive.
http://www.carolinamotorsportspark.com/turn1.html
**I presume the 2013 schedule will be out soon
No politics and real time in the seat. If you truly desire racing experience then Solo 1 and Solo 2 won't cut it. Unless you have an unlimited budget then go for spec racing like the Miata or BMW class if you must rub paint and accumulate points. I could not believe the politics in SCCA however buddies that have run NASA events have been happy. My recommendation is to run track days - three tracks within 2 hrs for me so somewhat easy for me to say. Get in a group with your skill set and dice it out. I have found that to be the most fun and economical and you can run your car in any configuration providing it "safe" to drive.
racerx
Autoxer
HI
Dallarax19 I'm sorry to disagree with you about solo not being a true racing experience .solo/autox Is every bit a true racing experience as road racing but everything happens a lot faster what I mein by that is when you go from one manuver to another in autox it happens within a couple hundredths of a second in road racing from one turn to another you've got more time to turn the wheel and get set up for the next turn.don't get me wrong both take a lot of talent to be good but a good autox driver will make a good road race driver a good road race drive won't necessarily make a good autox driver . Anybody that wants to get into road racing at any level needs to have a much bigger budget than autox . just tires alone will kill a budget. I get 2 seasons of hard core autox racing and street driving out of used R compound tires try that with road racing. and please don't get me wrong I'm not trying to argue hear ether unless it's a friendly argument. Have you ever been to an autox event and raced your Dallarax19 ? Have you ever been to the Tire Rack and raced on there cores ? how would you like to meet there this summer for some fun ? it looks like it's about 2 1/2 hours from you . dude it will be totally cool it's like a mini road cores over there .I'll start a separate discussion on the event forum so we can stop robing from Doug.
anyway back too Doug's question
Doug if I wear you go do autox first don't weary about what class they put you in or the politics just drive and learn about your car the better driver you are at autox the eser it will be to be a good driver at road racing and you'll save money too just the entry fee alown for road racing can be $120-$200 for one day autox is more like $30-$50 for the day .
Dallarax19 I'm sorry to disagree with you about solo not being a true racing experience .solo/autox Is every bit a true racing experience as road racing but everything happens a lot faster what I mein by that is when you go from one manuver to another in autox it happens within a couple hundredths of a second in road racing from one turn to another you've got more time to turn the wheel and get set up for the next turn.don't get me wrong both take a lot of talent to be good but a good autox driver will make a good road race driver a good road race drive won't necessarily make a good autox driver . Anybody that wants to get into road racing at any level needs to have a much bigger budget than autox . just tires alone will kill a budget. I get 2 seasons of hard core autox racing and street driving out of used R compound tires try that with road racing. and please don't get me wrong I'm not trying to argue hear ether unless it's a friendly argument. Have you ever been to an autox event and raced your Dallarax19 ? Have you ever been to the Tire Rack and raced on there cores ? how would you like to meet there this summer for some fun ? it looks like it's about 2 1/2 hours from you . dude it will be totally cool it's like a mini road cores over there .I'll start a separate discussion on the event forum so we can stop robing from Doug.
anyway back too Doug's question
Doug if I wear you go do autox first don't weary about what class they put you in or the politics just drive and learn about your car the better driver you are at autox the eser it will be to be a good driver at road racing and you'll save money too just the entry fee alown for road racing can be $120-$200 for one day autox is more like $30-$50 for the day .
I have raced for years
I have done the road race thing with X1/9's (I actually started the racers forum over at the mirafiori site), did the go-kart thing and autocrossed (solo on dirt), solo raced and pro rally'd. It boils down to a few things..... one form of racing is no better than the other, it is all down to what YOU want to do. Solo by far is the cheapiest and road /rally racing is the most expensive. As for what you want to do with your car will be up to what you have availible locally and what governing body is being used. With what you have, forget about running stock classes and you will need more work into your car to be competitive in other classes. Contact the local sports car club and tell them what you have and what you want to do. From there they will let you know what you need to do and what you are able to do with your car. That will get you started and stop you from spending money where you don't need it.
I hope this helps.
Warren
I have done the road race thing with X1/9's (I actually started the racers forum over at the mirafiori site), did the go-kart thing and autocrossed (solo on dirt), solo raced and pro rally'd. It boils down to a few things..... one form of racing is no better than the other, it is all down to what YOU want to do. Solo by far is the cheapiest and road /rally racing is the most expensive. As for what you want to do with your car will be up to what you have availible locally and what governing body is being used. With what you have, forget about running stock classes and you will need more work into your car to be competitive in other classes. Contact the local sports car club and tell them what you have and what you want to do. From there they will let you know what you need to do and what you are able to do with your car. That will get you started and stop you from spending money where you don't need it.
I hope this helps.
Warren
Dallarax19
Builder -Dallara Replica
Yeah actually I have done that.....
In 1988, 89, and some in 90 and 91 I ran Solo II competitively with a Volkswagen Fox, I did well in 88 and was second in class for 89. In 90 I was moving on to track events and ran my MR2 at several autocross events. I know the drill quite well and I have developed my own perspective on it from my experience. Here is a summary I posted on another forum topic but the story is still the same:
"I always make friends when I point these type of things out but autocross won't put the heat in the pads either. What is a typical autocross run 30-40 seconds and then you park the car? A typical lap at a road course is 80-90 seconds and it usually takes well in to the second lap to get the proper heat in. I think most autocross events give you 4 runs totaling roughly the equivalent of the 2 laps but you effectively park the car for a half hour every quarter lap - correct me if I am wrong on this. The big difference is the autocross isn't a continuous run and it doesn't build up the heat nor are you stopping from high speeds. By the way I have done both extensively so that isn't hearsay."
This goes for suspension tuning as well there isn't enough time to really get capable data to do proper adjustments with autocross. You are correct on driving "style" as well. On a high speed circuit you need to be smooth as silk or the car will come out from under you. In autocross it is more like rally racing where you poke and jab and the controls, not much high speed threshold driving. The fastest guys I saw in autocross were the guys who could muscle the car around the course. That isn't for me but many people really dig it.
By the way the last time I autocrossed was at the Fiat Freakout in Detroit a few years back. I was running the Freakout road rally and drove over to the autocross after the rally was done. I had my WRX packed with a card table and the rally gear but there was still time to enter the autocross and after some coaxing so I gave it a go. I removed all the stuff lined up and let go. The first two runs I went off course, I did not walk the course so I had to figure it out on the job. The third run was fast enough to get me third, actually I think it was second, place in the class - that cracked me up. I was beaten by a STI - go figure. I had a Freakout trophy from the event too, icing on the cake.
So I know the deal and am providing MY opinion base on MY experiences. I still recommend track days as the most bang for the buck. Just do the math on the actual seat time vs cash spent.
In 1988, 89, and some in 90 and 91 I ran Solo II competitively with a Volkswagen Fox, I did well in 88 and was second in class for 89. In 90 I was moving on to track events and ran my MR2 at several autocross events. I know the drill quite well and I have developed my own perspective on it from my experience. Here is a summary I posted on another forum topic but the story is still the same:
"I always make friends when I point these type of things out but autocross won't put the heat in the pads either. What is a typical autocross run 30-40 seconds and then you park the car? A typical lap at a road course is 80-90 seconds and it usually takes well in to the second lap to get the proper heat in. I think most autocross events give you 4 runs totaling roughly the equivalent of the 2 laps but you effectively park the car for a half hour every quarter lap - correct me if I am wrong on this. The big difference is the autocross isn't a continuous run and it doesn't build up the heat nor are you stopping from high speeds. By the way I have done both extensively so that isn't hearsay."
This goes for suspension tuning as well there isn't enough time to really get capable data to do proper adjustments with autocross. You are correct on driving "style" as well. On a high speed circuit you need to be smooth as silk or the car will come out from under you. In autocross it is more like rally racing where you poke and jab and the controls, not much high speed threshold driving. The fastest guys I saw in autocross were the guys who could muscle the car around the course. That isn't for me but many people really dig it.
By the way the last time I autocrossed was at the Fiat Freakout in Detroit a few years back. I was running the Freakout road rally and drove over to the autocross after the rally was done. I had my WRX packed with a card table and the rally gear but there was still time to enter the autocross and after some coaxing so I gave it a go. I removed all the stuff lined up and let go. The first two runs I went off course, I did not walk the course so I had to figure it out on the job. The third run was fast enough to get me third, actually I think it was second, place in the class - that cracked me up. I was beaten by a STI - go figure. I had a Freakout trophy from the event too, icing on the cake.
So I know the deal and am providing MY opinion base on MY experiences. I still recommend track days as the most bang for the buck. Just do the math on the actual seat time vs cash spent.
autocross =/= track days =/= roadracing.
Completely different animals.
Also, if you do not believe good data can be gathered at an autocross, you may want to check out what the "fast" guys are doing....
Completely different animals.
Also, if you do not believe good data can be gathered at an autocross, you may want to check out what the "fast" guys are doing....
racerx
Autoxer
Dallarax19 I too
Have been autox racing since 89 used to run a civic until I had a chance to run my older brothers X1/9 ever since that day I had to have one . So you only got 4 runs? so now wonder you have a bad taste in your mouth about autox. I run with Windy City Miata club and we get 12-14 runs which is more than enough to figer out suspension tuning, tire pressure and driving technique. Theirs way more to it than poke and jab you've got to be smoth . I am one of the fast guys and I don't muscel my car around .About brake pads if you get the right pad compound you don't have to wait for them to heat up to bit . Thanks for the info on your racing history but my question was have you ever been to an autox event with your X1/9 ? Like I said bring it on out to the tire rack in July . I tell you what I challenge you to bring it out to the Tire Rack .
BTW I used to own a 02 WRX I ran it at an autox event or 2 my 70hp X1/9 is way faster .
Have been autox racing since 89 used to run a civic until I had a chance to run my older brothers X1/9 ever since that day I had to have one . So you only got 4 runs? so now wonder you have a bad taste in your mouth about autox. I run with Windy City Miata club and we get 12-14 runs which is more than enough to figer out suspension tuning, tire pressure and driving technique. Theirs way more to it than poke and jab you've got to be smoth . I am one of the fast guys and I don't muscel my car around .About brake pads if you get the right pad compound you don't have to wait for them to heat up to bit . Thanks for the info on your racing history but my question was have you ever been to an autox event with your X1/9 ? Like I said bring it on out to the tire rack in July . I tell you what I challenge you to bring it out to the Tire Rack .
BTW I used to own a 02 WRX I ran it at an autox event or 2 my 70hp X1/9 is way faster .
Dallarax19
Builder -Dallara Replica
Guys just do the math
it is very simple. No matter your perspective 40 sec per run (optimistic by the way for an autocross) *4 runs equals 160 seconds or 2 minutes 40 seconds vs 80 minutes on a a typical track day. Autocross is just you on the "track" vs racing or even track days with competitors. They are not the same, not nearly. Guys you can challenge this all you want but those are the facts. I am sure you would agree if you have done autocross and track events to compare.
it is very simple. No matter your perspective 40 sec per run (optimistic by the way for an autocross) *4 runs equals 160 seconds or 2 minutes 40 seconds vs 80 minutes on a a typical track day. Autocross is just you on the "track" vs racing or even track days with competitors. They are not the same, not nearly. Guys you can challenge this all you want but those are the facts. I am sure you would agree if you have done autocross and track events to compare.
Pete Whitstone
True Classic
Agreed on several points...
I road-raced in the SCCA and later in a small grass-roots organization called COMMA at Hallett outside Tulsa. There is no comparison as far as seat time. A practice Saturday in COMMA consists of 7 20-minute sessions, and by 20 minutes I mean 20 minutes of green flag conditions (hopefully anyway), not 20 minutes from grid formation to checkered. Sunday morning, same deal, with 3 practice sessions. Then a 20 minute qualifying race, followed by a 30 minute feature race. Literally hours and hours of seat time per weekend, for a cost of about $250 for both days.
I got out of the SCCA because of their politics. And by politics I don't mean big, club level issues. I mean stewards, starters, scrutineers, etc. working hard to build thier own little fiefdoms in which they had the power to push us little grunt racers around at will, and did so at every opportunity. COMMA was full of SCCA refugees for that very reason. Not to mention the rulebook nightmare...
I also have to say that while the driving style of autocross may be different than road racing (more intense, sharper, no time to gather wits), try autocrossing when you are coming up on slower traffic, faster traffic is bearing down on you, mirrors are not always adequate to see everyone around you, you don't know which way the other guys are going to go, and if you miscalculate something, you are taking out thousands or tens of thousands of dollars of equipment that belongs to someone else. Plus a very real risk of injury. You would be incorrect to assume that road racing is less intense, duller and with more time to gather your wits. What fun would that be? The high stakes are what make it way more intense that the possibility of knocking down a cone. I don't mean that in a rude or offensive way, but autocross is not the same as door-to-door action.
Pete
I road-raced in the SCCA and later in a small grass-roots organization called COMMA at Hallett outside Tulsa. There is no comparison as far as seat time. A practice Saturday in COMMA consists of 7 20-minute sessions, and by 20 minutes I mean 20 minutes of green flag conditions (hopefully anyway), not 20 minutes from grid formation to checkered. Sunday morning, same deal, with 3 practice sessions. Then a 20 minute qualifying race, followed by a 30 minute feature race. Literally hours and hours of seat time per weekend, for a cost of about $250 for both days.
I got out of the SCCA because of their politics. And by politics I don't mean big, club level issues. I mean stewards, starters, scrutineers, etc. working hard to build thier own little fiefdoms in which they had the power to push us little grunt racers around at will, and did so at every opportunity. COMMA was full of SCCA refugees for that very reason. Not to mention the rulebook nightmare...
I also have to say that while the driving style of autocross may be different than road racing (more intense, sharper, no time to gather wits), try autocrossing when you are coming up on slower traffic, faster traffic is bearing down on you, mirrors are not always adequate to see everyone around you, you don't know which way the other guys are going to go, and if you miscalculate something, you are taking out thousands or tens of thousands of dollars of equipment that belongs to someone else. Plus a very real risk of injury. You would be incorrect to assume that road racing is less intense, duller and with more time to gather your wits. What fun would that be? The high stakes are what make it way more intense that the possibility of knocking down a cone. I don't mean that in a rude or offensive way, but autocross is not the same as door-to-door action.
Pete
Pete Whitstone
True Classic
I know Pete. 
BEEK
True Classic
my .02
i have autoxed once! once!
i have 10,000 + laps of door to door competition under my belt, well some of it may hang over now
i do want to get into road racing,a s i have the same issue of time and money vs seat time. i raced fiat 124 coupes in nascars weekly racing series. won 2 championships and 52 races, never finished out of the top 5 in points. it was fun. i enjoyed building the cars as much as driving them. the fun was in the engineering, what i could get away with. and beating people with much larger budgets, and left them scratching their heads. after my tenure with my fiats i graduated to late models (purpose built tube frame cars 650hp and 2500 lbs, similar to gt1 road race cars) ran very well despite my lack of budget, i was spending 2500 a race to win 500. but the people i was racing against were spending 20,000 a week to win 2500. but it was winning money. but the seat time was incredible as most cases the races lasted 2 hours, and i had 2, 1 hour practice sessions each weekend and thursday evenings for 2 hours. burnt up tires (largest cost).
left that for a crew chief position on a ARCA team for a couple of years. then dabbled in racing again on and off. but in todays economy racing is not on the front burner as expendable income is not there as it was in the past.
now im very interested in road racing 2-3 times a year, have a scorpion im looking into building for NASA, or maybe just run one of my late models, still have 4. but the thing that im looking into is the hours of track time and the door to door competition, i dont have to win, i just want to go fast and have fun for a few hours at a time. thats the reason drag racing never worked for me. i dont want to race for 10 seconds at a time.
i have autoxed once! once!
i have 10,000 + laps of door to door competition under my belt, well some of it may hang over now
i do want to get into road racing,a s i have the same issue of time and money vs seat time. i raced fiat 124 coupes in nascars weekly racing series. won 2 championships and 52 races, never finished out of the top 5 in points. it was fun. i enjoyed building the cars as much as driving them. the fun was in the engineering, what i could get away with. and beating people with much larger budgets, and left them scratching their heads. after my tenure with my fiats i graduated to late models (purpose built tube frame cars 650hp and 2500 lbs, similar to gt1 road race cars) ran very well despite my lack of budget, i was spending 2500 a race to win 500. but the people i was racing against were spending 20,000 a week to win 2500. but it was winning money. but the seat time was incredible as most cases the races lasted 2 hours, and i had 2, 1 hour practice sessions each weekend and thursday evenings for 2 hours. burnt up tires (largest cost).
left that for a crew chief position on a ARCA team for a couple of years. then dabbled in racing again on and off. but in todays economy racing is not on the front burner as expendable income is not there as it was in the past.
now im very interested in road racing 2-3 times a year, have a scorpion im looking into building for NASA, or maybe just run one of my late models, still have 4. but the thing that im looking into is the hours of track time and the door to door competition, i dont have to win, i just want to go fast and have fun for a few hours at a time. thats the reason drag racing never worked for me. i dont want to race for 10 seconds at a time.