Tires - anyone have any experience with...

Larry

Larry

True Classic
I'm starting to look for new tires. In 185/60-13, I can only find the Toyo Proxess R888R, but I've heard they're not very good in the rain - which given the tread, makes sense.

If you look at 175/70-13, there's a lot more options. I was looking on Tires-Easy.com - https://www.tires-easy.com/175-70-13/maxxis-tires/ma-202/tirecode/TP20541400 and found lots of tires, so I looked for anything with a Treadwear Rating of 500 or less. My thinking is something higher than 500 (more realistically 400) will be fairly hard and not as much fun on windy roads.

But I've never heard of any of the tires listed except for the Toyo Eclipse which has a treadwear rating of 500.

Does anyone have any experience with any of these tires?
 
How often are you planning on driving in the rain? Also, on the X, the Toyo's might be as good as any other option as the X is not known for it's wet water handling! ;) Also, make sure to look at some tire size comparison as the difference between a 185/60 and a 175/70 might be more than you think.
 
I have Achillies 122's in 175-70-13. I've been happy with them so far. The last 2 sets of tires dry rotted before they wore out so I hesitate to pay big money for them. The FFO this year proved their worth in the rain....
 
Larry said:
I'm starting to look for new tires. In 185/60-13, I can only find the Toyo Proxess R888R, but I've heard they're not very good in the rain - which given the tread, makes sense.

If you look at 175/70-13, there's a lot more options. I was looking on Tires-Easy.com - https://www.tires-easy.com/175-70-13/maxxis-tires/ma-202/tirecode/TP20541400 and found lots of tires, so I looked for anything with a Treadwear Rating of 500 or less. My thinking is something higher than 500 (more realistically 400) will be fairly hard and not as much fun on windy roads.

But I've never heard of any of the tires listed except for the Toyo Eclipse which has a treadwear rating of 500.

Does anyone have any experience with any of these tires?
Click to expand...
Tire and wheel is a matched set, always verified by engineers during the new car development process. If you choose to modify from stock, it is wise to copy what that manufacturer did. For X 1/9:
1974-1978 came with 145HR13 or 145SR13 tires on 4 1/2" wide rims.
Those wheels were mostly tube type. It was a matched set; tube type TT wheel, tube, and tube type tire. Since tube type wheels and tires are an obsolete technology for sports car use, you might want to switch to tubeless wheels. Tubeless wheels have humps inboard of the rim flange which prevent the bead from unseating during hard cornering or evasive maneuvers.
When I had these cars, I would get rid of those TT wheels and upgrade to the steel wheels which came on 1979 and later X cars which were 5 x 13 tubeless wheels. The wider wheel allows support of a wider, lower profile tire like 165/70SR13 which was the standard X tire starting in 1979.
Some people choose to put a larger diameter tire to get the gearing effect (lower rpm at a given road speed) for highway travel. Others choose a smaller diameter tire for quicker acceleration (and consequent more engine noise at cruise).
I selected 175/70TR13 Michelin Defender tires on Fiat Speedline 5 1/2 x 13 tubeless alloy wheels (sometimes known as IRON CROSS style). These fit perfectly with no rubbing except for at full lock, the inside tire shoulder kisses the inner fender liner. There are some good choices for this size tire at tirerack.com for 80 dollars each in the USA. Most people choose wide wheels and tires for cosmetic reasons. The widest original equipment wheel tire combo on mid 1980s X 1/9 was 185/60HR13 on a 5 1/2 x 13 wheel. That was enough for 75hp 1500 FI engine. You can do a functional test to verify that your X needs wider wheels and wider tires:
If your car spins its tires on clean dry pavement during acceleration, or your drive tires spin (burn rubber) when accelerating out of a corner, you may benefit from better performing tires or wider wheels and tires.
5 1/2 x 13 Speedline Iron Cross wheel shown below. Yellow car is 185/60ZR13 on 6 x13 Revolution wheels. On this lowered race car, some fender lip rolling was required to prevent the outside tire shoulder rubbing. At full lock the inside shoulder would touch the inner fender.
 

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johnph said:
Tire and wheel is a matched set, always verified by engineers during the new car development process. If you choose to modify from stock, it is wise to copy what that manufacturer did. For X 1/9:
1974-1978 came with 145HR13 or 145SR13 tires on 4 1/2" wide rims.
Those wheels were mostly tube type. It was a matched set; tube type TT wheel, tube, and tube type tire. Since tube type wheels and tires are an obsolete technology for sports car use, you might want to switch to tubeless wheels. Tubeless wheels have humps inboard of the rim flange which prevent the bead from unseating during hard cornering or evasive maneuvers.
When I had these cars, I would get rid of those TT wheels and upgrade to the steel wheels which came on 1979 and later X cars which were 5 x 13 tubeless wheels. The wider wheel allows support of a wider, lower profile tire like 165/70SR13 which was the standard X tire starting in 1979.
Some people choose to put a larger diameter tire to get the gearing effect (lower rpm at a given road speed) for highway travel. Others choose a smaller diameter tire for quicker acceleration (and consequent more engine noise at cruise).
I selected 175/70TR13 Michelin Defender tires on Fiat Speedline 5 1/2 x 13 tubeless alloy wheels (sometimes known as IRON CROSS style). These fit perfectly with no rubbing except for at full lock, the inside tire shoulder kisses the inner fender liner. There are some good choices for this size tire at tirerack.com for 80 dollars each in the USA. Most people choose wide wheels and tires for cosmetic reasons. The widest original equipment wheel tire combo on mid 1980s X 1/9 was 185/60HR13 on a 5 1/2 x 13 wheel. That was enough for 75hp 1500 FI engine. You can do a functional test to verify that your X needs wider wheels and wider tires:
If your car spins its tires on clean dry pavement during acceleration, or your drive tires spin (burn rubber) when accelerating out of a corner, you may benefit from better performing tires or wider wheels and tires.
5 1/2 x 13 Speedline Iron Cross wheel shown below.
Click to expand...
An ancient tire guy once told me that it's easy to tell from the outside whether a cast wheel was made intended for tubed tires or for tubeless tires. This is important for exxie owners to know because some of the classic Italian cast aluminum and magnesium alloy wheels we love were made during that changeover era, so a style of wheel we like might have an early tubed version and a later tubeless version. My CD58s are like that.

A wheel made for tubed tires has a plain, straight hole in it for the valve stem.

A wheel made for tubeless tires has a stepped hole in it, which provides a ledge or rim for the valve stem to form itself around.
 
Never had any trouble/drama in the rain on R888's..... I've got a used set in that size on steel wheels you can have for free, I'm in Los Angeles...
IMG_20230729_085620015_HDR~2.jpg
 
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I've been running the 185/60 R13-Achilles 122's (purchased from Gigatire.com) for over a year now. I have been very pleased with their performance. Can't speak to their wet weather behavior as I don't drive my X in the rain.
 
I've been running R888s for 2 years now. Warm weather and cold (cool actually, I'm in central Ca,) Don't make a habit of driving the X in the rain but the one time I got caught in wet weather I didn't notice any problem with them. I actually ran it through some cornering just to see if it would be a problem. Personally short of a deluge or really freezing temps I don't see an issue with the Rs on the street, and they're pretty sticky which makes them fun.
IMG_2706.jpg
 
fastx19 said:
How often are you planning on driving in the rain? Also, on the X, the Toyo's might be as good as any other option as the X is not known for it's wet water handling! ;) Also, make sure to look at some tire size comparison as the difference between a 185/60 and a 175/70 might be more than you think.
Click to expand...
A little (or a lot of rain) doesn't mean I can't drive my car. Well as long as I have RainX on the windshield. If I'm on a tour (a few hours or a few days and about 1,000 miles) with FIAT America, I don't let it bother me. I'm in Northern California, so my idea of "winterizing" my car is to apply Rain-X to the windshield.

In the past, I preferred not to drive in the rain because of various leaks from worn weather stripping which is being replaced this month. My X isn't my daily driver, but having some rain grip would be preferred.

I'm currently running 175/70-13 General Altimax tires for almost 8 years. I grew up hearing the General jingle - "Sooner or later, you'll drive General." They were good for the first 4-5 years, but while they have lots of tread, they're lacking in even dry traction.
 
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Either get the Toyos or order a set of Michelin Exaltos in 185/60/13 from Longstone in the UK. They'll be on your doorstep in less than a week.
 
I went with Pirelli CN36 tires which were excellent. A few years ago, Pirelli started making them again with modern processes and materials. They have a 175/70-13 available.

https://www.pirelli.com/tyres/en-ww/car/collection/product/cinturato-cn-36
Click to expand...
I got a set of the "new-retro" Pirelli CN36 tires in 175/70-13 about a year ago. They are terrific in both dry and wet conditions. I had used several different brands previously in 185/60-13 so was a bit reluctant to go to narrower tires, but honestly I haven't felt any reduction in grip with the Pirellis. What I really like about them is that the transition from understeer to oversteer is smoother and more progressive than on anything else I've used on X1/9s. The CN36s are not cheap, but they're worth the money. Also, they're V-rated.
 
dllubin said:
I never tried 175/70-13 on my X but I did have pretty good luck with the185/70-13 size back in the 70s (before 60 series were available). I went with Pirelli CN36 tires which were excellent. A few years ago, Pirelli started making them again with modern processes and materials. They have a 175/70-13 available.

https://www.pirelli.com/tyres/en-ww/car/collection/product/cinturato-cn-36
Click to expand...
Interesting.....

Their website is somewhat funky. When I click on the link, I get 14" and 15" wheels. I had to go to the home page to find the tire. Silly web designers...
 
I have a set of Toyo RRRs and a set of Yoko A539 (?) that I both use.
Believe me, there is no comparison.
Rain use is not the issue.
The Toyo has very stiff sidewalls, making the ride harsh and crashy. And they are loud!
Those of you with Toyos who don‘t notice these things, throw on a set of normal street tires for comparison and you wil. 😁
Yes, the Toyos have much more grip on the street, but is it worth it? You decide, some people have more fun with tires that have a little less grip.

I am not dissing the Toyo, I just want to warn people who haven‘t run a „race“ tire of the disadvantages in normal use.
If you aren‘t a canyon carver and „normal“ use your car, I would stick to street tires.
 
johnph said:
Tire and wheel is a matched set, always verified by engineers during the new car development process. If you choose to modify from stock, it is wise to copy what that manufacturer did. For X 1/9:
1974-1978 came with 145HR13 or 145SR13 tires on 4 1/2" wide rims.
Those wheels were mostly tube type. It was a matched set; tube type TT wheel, tube, and tube type tire. Since tube type wheels and tires are an obsolete technology for sports car use, you might want to switch to tubeless wheels. Tubeless wheels have humps inboard of the rim flange which prevent the bead from unseating during hard cornering or evasive maneuvers.
When I had these cars, I would get rid of those TT wheels and upgrade to the steel wheels which came on 1979 and later X cars which were 5 x 13 tubeless wheels. The wider wheel allows support of a wider, lower profile tire like 165/70SR13 which was the standard X tire starting in 1979.
Some people choose to put a larger diameter tire to get the gearing effect (lower rpm at a given road speed) for highway travel. Others choose a smaller diameter tire for quicker acceleration (and consequent more engine noise at cruise).
I selected 175/70TR13 Michelin Defender tires on Fiat Speedline 5 1/2 x 13 tubeless alloy wheels (sometimes known as IRON CROSS style). These fit perfectly with no rubbing except for at full lock, the inside tire shoulder kisses the inner fender liner. There are some good choices for this size tire at tirerack.com for 80 dollars each in the USA. Most people choose wide wheels and tires for cosmetic reasons. The widest original equipment wheel tire combo on mid 1980s X 1/9 was 185/60HR13 on a 5 1/2 x 13 wheel. That was enough for 75hp 1500 FI engine. You can do a functional test to verify that your X needs wider wheels and wider tires:
If your car spins its tires on clean dry pavement during acceleration, or your drive tires spin (burn rubber) when accelerating out of a corner, you may benefit from better performing tires or wider wheels and tires.
5 1/2 x 13 Speedline Iron Cross wheel shown below. Yellow car is 185/60ZR13 on 6 x13 Revolution wheels. On this lowered race car, some fender lip rolling was required to prevent the outside tire shoulder rubbing. At full lock the inside shoulder would touch the inner fender.
Click to expand...
My car came with 185/60-13 tires mounted on CD-58s (5J x 13"). That's been the size I've been using up until 2015 when I couldn't find anything in that size. I get absolutely no rub ever with the CD-58s. Now my aluminum replica CD-30s... those give some rub at full lock.

My concern about the tires at TireRack is the treadwear rating (UTQG) is 680, 700 and 500. Those high treadwear ratings make me think they're not really intended for an X to be tossed around corners or on windy roads. Back in the day, I used to run AVS Intermediates on my car. Sure they might wear out in less than 10,000 miles, but my car gets at most 7,000 miles a year - more like 5,000 or less given it's not my daily driver.

Way off topic... but I think you gave me a '74 driver's seat after seeing the sad state of my driver's seat at Concorso Italiano some number of years ago.
 
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Dan Sarandrea (Phila) said:
An ancient tire guy once told me that it's easy to tell from the outside whether a cast wheel was made intended for tubed tires or for tubeless tires. This is important for exxie owners to know because some of the classic Italian cast aluminum and magnesium alloy wheels we love were made during that changeover era, so a style of wheel we like might have an early tubed version and a later tubeless version. My CD58s are like that.

A wheel made for tubed tires has a plain, straight hole in it for the valve stem.

A wheel made for tubeless tires has a stepped hole in it, which provides a ledge or rim for the valve stem to form itself around.
Click to expand...
A tire guy told me that too. My CD58s are like that - the tubeless version.
 
Lowtechprime said:
Never had any trouble/drama in the rain on R888's..... I've got a used set in that size on steel wheels you can have for free, I'm in Los Angeles...
Click to expand...
Good to know they've been good... wait you're in LA. Does it ever rain in LA??

Thanks for the offer for the wheels. I might be interested in them for a project. I'll PM you to see if we can work this out.
 
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