Water Pump Replacement Help

Brandon, sounds like you are doing really well with this. Keep at it, it is frustrating but doable.

First, if the AC system is still charged with refrigerant it is pressurized. So when you loosen the hose fittings the pressure will blow out, leaking refrigerant which can be harmful. Most often the system has leaked all of the refrigerant out already so not an issue. But if it is still full, the "proper" way to empty it is to have a AC shop 'capture' it with a machine designed for this. However its not likely that you can get the car to them for this. Due to the refrigerant being a Ozone issue, it is illegal to let it escape into the air. But if that should accidentally happen, don't let it contact your face/skin...wear protective gear. An option to this is to leave the hoses attached and wrestle the compressor off its brackets and swing it out of the way with the hoses still connected (not convenient but avoids the refrigerant issue).

Second, the 2 bolts that connect that metal pipe to the back of the water pump are very difficult to reach...especially the one closest to the block. Try a thin-wall socket with a LONG extension and a ratchet way over from the thermostat end. Once you get them off consider replacing them with a different type bolt. They make bolts with smaller heads, this allows a smaller size socket and makes getting them back on much easier....see the difference:
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Between the AC compressor issue and the water pipe issue, you see why I consider just leaving the water pump housing in place and only replacing the pump itself. That avoids all this. But like Karl said, "ideally" the impeller clearance should be checked between the pump and the housing.

As for your questions:
I'm not clear which 2 nuts on the AC you are referring to? Can you post a picture? There shouldn't be any "special" wrenches needed, but until I can envision which ones you are asking about I really can't answer.

In my opinion the cooling system should be flushed prior to replacing anything. But that may be too late, so not a big deal. In recent years (recent being relative to my age), the coolant system flushing products available on the market do not seem to work at all. There are lots of opinions as to how to do it, try searching the topic on Google for suggestions and choose what seems good for you. Others will not like my approach, its a bit aggressive (I use a strong acid product then neutralize and rinse it well).

Getting the belts off (and back on) is a genuine issue with the AC system design on the X1/9. It will partly depend on the year and options you have; for example California cars in '79 had additional smog equipment with even more belts that was a real nightmare. Plus there is more than one arrangement for the X's belts, despite all service manuals only showing one. So depending on which one you have it will differ. However, in general each belt has the ability to be adjusted (at least to a little extent). So if you get the sequence correct it will work. Its something of a puzzle; first one belt is adjusted and secured, then the next is adjusted and secured, etc. If they are not performed in the right sequence they it will not happen because each adjustment effects the next. Same for removal. This all depends on your system's design. If you can post pictures it will help to answer better. I found the system's design actually did not allow enough movement for a couple of the belts to be properly adjusted; either the belt was too short to get on, or too long to get adjusted enough. So I modified parts to allow a little more travel in adjustments. Made a world of difference. I also ended up using different sizes of belts than what's stated in the parts guides (I still think those listings are incorrect, NONE of the belts sold by the usual vendors were correct for mine). Others resorted to "stretching" the belts over the pulley lip (which isn't ideal). Furthermore, not all years have the "split" style pulley Dan refers to (mine does not). Some AC system cars are different and have various methods of adjustment for each belt (a VERY poor design of adjustment). So again, it depends on your system (pictures please).

Finally, you are correct, the available manuals are extremely deficient (or worse, incorrect) in this area (and many others). Others may disagree with that comment, just my opinion. That's all part of the "fun" of learning how to work on these cars.
 
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Karl, I think you have to remove the entire housing because there isn't enough room to pull the pump out of the housing when it's mounted in the car. Of course you can remove the housing with the pump attached, then replace only the pump and reuse the housing (which is cast iron) then reinstall the assembly.

I found this to be correct. The housing must be removed, which means the alternator and AC compressor if equipped.
 
Brandon, sounds like you are doing really well with this. Keep at it, it is frustrating but doable.

First, if the AC system is still charged with refrigerant it is pressurized. So when you loosen the hose fittings the pressure will blow out, leaking refrigerant which can be harmful. Most often the system has leaked all of the refrigerant out already so not an issue. But if it is still full, the "proper" way to empty it is to have a AC shop 'capture' it with a machine designed for this. However its not likely that you can get the car to them for this. Due to the refrigerant being a Ozone issue, it is illegal to let it escape into the air. But if that should accidentally happen, don't let it contact your face/skin...wear protective gear. An option to this is to leave the hoses attached and wrestle the compressor off its brackets and swing it out of the way with the hoses still connected (not convenient but avoids the refrigerant issue).

Second, the 2 bolts that connect that metal pipe to the back of the water pump are very difficult to reach...especially the one closest to the block. Try a thin-wall socket with a LONG extension and a ratchet way over from the thermostat end. Once you get them off consider replacing them with a different type bolt. They make bolts with smaller heads, this allows a smaller size socket and makes getting them back on much easier....see the difference:
View attachment 9197 View attachment 9198
Between the AC compressor issue and the water pipe issue, you see why I consider just leaving the water pump housing in place and only replacing the pump itself. That avoids all this. But like Karl said, "ideally" the impeller clearance should be checked between the pump and the housing.

As for your questions:
I'm not clear which 2 nuts on the AC you are referring to? Can you post a picture? There shouldn't be any "special" wrenches needed, but until I can envision which ones you are asking about I really can't answer.

In my opinion the cooling system should be flushed prior to replacing anything. But that may be too late, so not a big deal. In recent years (recent being relative to my age), the coolant system flushing products available on the market do not seem to work at all. There are lots of opinions as to how to do it, try searching the topic on Google for suggestions and choose what seems good for you. Others will not like my approach, its a bit aggressive (I use a strong acid product then neutralize and rinse it well).

Getting the belts off (and back on) is a genuine issue with the AC system design on the X1/9. It will partly depend on the year and options you have; for example California cars in '79 had additional smog equipment with even more belts that was a real nightmare. Plus there is more than one arrangement for the X's belts, despite all service manuals only showing one. So depending on which one you have it will differ. However, in general each belt has the ability to be adjusted (at least to a little extent). So if you get the sequence correct it will work. Its something of a puzzle; first one belt is adjusted and secured, then the next is adjusted and secured, etc. If they are not performed in the right sequence they it will not happen because each adjustment effects the next. Same for removal. This all depends on your system's design. If you can post pictures it will help to answer better. I found the system's design actually did not allow enough movement for a couple of the belts to be properly adjusted; either the belt was too short to get on, or too long to get adjusted enough. So I modified parts to allow a little more travel in adjustments. Made a world of difference. I also ended up using different sizes of belts than what's stated in the parts guides (I still think those listings are incorrect, NONE of the belts sold by the usual vendors were correct for mine). Others resorted to "stretching" the belts over the pulley lip (which isn't ideal). Furthermore, not all years have the "split" style pulley Dan refers to (mine does not). Some AC system cars are different and have various methods of adjustment for each belt (a VERY poor design of adjustment). So again, it depends on your system (pictures please).

Finally, you are correct, the available manuals are extremely deficient (or worse, incorrect) in this area (and many others). Others may disagree with that comment, just my opinion. That's all part of the "fun" of learning how to work on these cars.

Dr. Jeff - did you replace one of these just yesterday? After my last post I proceeded to start at it again and your instructions are amazingly on point!

As an update, the pump is sitting my my workbench!

3DC74234-86E7-4FC3-8AEA-DEFF1D4BCE33.jpeg


Rather than fight with the bolts on the back of the metal tube that goes to the pump, I removed the two hoses on the other end. I couldn’t envision reassembling that bolt while the tube was still on the car.

The pump with tube is best removed at an angle down through the back of the wheel well.

I was able to set both the alternator and the AC compressor in the trunk with ample room to work on the rest of the water pump disassembly.
AC6ACA14-2AC2-4C3F-B1AC-97A0AA22792E.jpeg


Time to relax and gets some parts headed my way!

I’ve taken a ton of notes and photos, once done with this project I’ll create a post with step by step directions for the next person that runs into a leaking water pump.

Thanks again everyone!

Brandon

PS - Next project is a transmission rebuild. I am not doing that, I’m taking the car to Steve Holescher in WV.
 
I found this to be correct. The housing must be removed, which means the alternator and AC compressor if equipped.
On mine I was able to get the pump out without removing the housing by taking the pulley off the pump first. On the AC version of water pump the pulley bolts onto a flange (on the pump's shaft) with 3 bolts. By taking the pulley off there was enough room to wiggle the pump out at a angle. It might not be the same for everyone due to all the subtle differences between cars?
Dr. Jeff - did you replace one of these just yesterday?
No, but believe me you won't forget it by the time you are done. I hate to say it but the job has only begun. Finding the "correct" replacement parts might be one challenge...hopefully it goes better for you than it did for me. And reassembling everything has it own issues. But just keep taking it a step at a time (sounds like a "recovery program" for self abuse).
 
Hello,

Should I use any type of gasket seal material on my gaskets when installing the water pump? Or, just use the gasket?

Thanks, Brandon
 
Last evening I completed the new water pump installation and had all the components back on the car except the trunk access panel. I tested the car and it maintained temp at about 150 degrees. (Bottom line is 130, next is 190 and it was right in between so I guess 150). The issue is that there was a horrible noise every 20-30 seconds of bearing squealing. Not a high pitch belt squeal, but rather more of a grinding squeal noise. I rechecked the belts and they are tight, not overly tightened and they are the ones the Matt sent from MWB and were nearly the exact same size although my old ones were a little longer, not more than 1/4" at max if that. When the water pump is spinning and when it makes the noise the belt actually slows rotation for a moment, it lasts maybe 1 second. Since my alternator had no issues before disassembly I feel like maybe the bearing were faulty in the water pump. The pump did spin freely on the work bench before putting it on the car.

Anyone has thoughts on what it could be if not the bearings in the water pump?

PS - I just double checked the AC belt to be sure it was in the correct grove and it's on the same as prior to disassembly, the outside v groove.
 
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You should be able to pin-point the location of the noise by using some sort of stethoscope. They have ones specifically for use on cars, not that expensive:
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Or you can just use a length of hose, with one end in your ear and a solid rod (long bolt for example) stuffed in the other end. With either one, you touch the end of the rod onto various spots and listen for the noise to become obvious. You might even be able to do this with a really long screwdriver; the end of the handle up to your ear, the other end touching things.

This will determine the source of the noise and you can proceed from there.
 
You might even be able to do this with a really long screwdriver; the end of the handle up to your ear, the other end touching things.
That's a good tip from Dr. Jeff! Using the LONG screwdriver as he describes is as good as a stethoscope - and much cheaper! :)

cheers, IanL - NZ
 
Not to hi-jack the thread, but what are everyone's tips for removing the water pump pully with the water pump still in the car?

How do you brace the pump from turning?

Last time I replaced my water pump I had to use an impact to remove the water pump pully after I took it out of the car. Could't find a way to get the required grip/leverage with it still in the car.
 
Assuming you have the type of pulley with three bolts holding it to the flange, try loosening the bolts before loosening the V-belt tension. The belt should hold the pulley from turning while you free up the bolts. Then remove the belt and finish removing the bolts.
 
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