beezee
True Classic
I replaced my tires last year. I could not find a decent set of 185/60 13s anywhere in Canada, so I ordered a set of Yokohama tires from the UK. Shipping was not cheap, but that was my best option for getting good tires.
The Rat's Nest - 81 X1/9 Build
- Thread starter Clatter
- Start date
JKIDD
Auto Addict
I bought these due to lack of options. Had them for a year now & have been happy. Better than the Nexen tires I had previously. I can't bring myself to spend too much on tires as the last 2 sets dry rotted long before they wore out.
Tom Ginefra
True Classic
With the exception of mine being 185/60, this is the same model and brand I chose and have been "very happy" with them.
Unfortunately, their prices have gone up recently, along with a lack of availability.
rx1900
1981 X1/9
Hey Clatter. Firstly...a hearty welcome to the forum. As someone from the rust belt, your X looks amazingly rust-free ans solid. So that is good ! Shame about the rat issue though.... luckily we dont have have them here. Too cold up here for them I guess...
FYI...about the head bolts in case you do not know.
Early 1500 X1/9s..up to mid '81 or so....had the head held on by 5 m12 bolts ( with 19mm heads ) on the front side, and 5 m12 studs ( with 19mm nuts ) on the rear side. Those bolts and studs were a tight fit through the holes in the head.....and the shanks of the studs would seize in the holes. Making it difficult at times to get the head off.....Yes...it sometimes needed that special tool you referred to.
Sometime in mid '81 or so...it seems to vary.....Fiat changed up to instead the head being bolted on with all 10 m10 bolts ( with 17mm heads ). That seems to be what you have ? They had mostly a reduced shank...and rarely seize in to cause an issue. Not clear to me what your issue is there ? Did you get all 10 bolts off ? Or did one - or more - bolts snap off ? If so...just the head snapped off ? Or what ? IF...all the bolts came out...or at least snapped off.....the head should come off pretty easily. Maybe it is just stuck by the gasket...or there are 2 dowels that maybe are seized a bit. In either case...a couple of whacks with a rubber hammer or a 2x4 in an upwards direction should free the head....That special head removal tool wont work on these heads....
At some point in maybe '85 or so.....Fiat changed things a bit. Still 10 x m10 main bolts...but they added 4 more m8 bolts on the spark plug side of the head. If the PO had changed the engine to a later one....maybe look for those.
Good l;uck !
FYI...about the head bolts in case you do not know.
Early 1500 X1/9s..up to mid '81 or so....had the head held on by 5 m12 bolts ( with 19mm heads ) on the front side, and 5 m12 studs ( with 19mm nuts ) on the rear side. Those bolts and studs were a tight fit through the holes in the head.....and the shanks of the studs would seize in the holes. Making it difficult at times to get the head off.....Yes...it sometimes needed that special tool you referred to.
Sometime in mid '81 or so...it seems to vary.....Fiat changed up to instead the head being bolted on with all 10 m10 bolts ( with 17mm heads ). That seems to be what you have ? They had mostly a reduced shank...and rarely seize in to cause an issue. Not clear to me what your issue is there ? Did you get all 10 bolts off ? Or did one - or more - bolts snap off ? If so...just the head snapped off ? Or what ? IF...all the bolts came out...or at least snapped off.....the head should come off pretty easily. Maybe it is just stuck by the gasket...or there are 2 dowels that maybe are seized a bit. In either case...a couple of whacks with a rubber hammer or a 2x4 in an upwards direction should free the head....That special head removal tool wont work on these heads....
At some point in maybe '85 or so.....Fiat changed things a bit. Still 10 x m10 main bolts...but they added 4 more m8 bolts on the spark plug side of the head. If the PO had changed the engine to a later one....maybe look for those.
Good l;uck !
rx1900
1981 X1/9
Regarding tires........although it depends a bit on the wheel used...and your particular alignment settings....
An '81 X1/9 would have come with 165/70R13. Most any tire of that size will fit fine and not rub. A safe choice !!
A 155/80R13 or 175/70R13 tire - more easily available these days - WILL usually rub !! Many here are in denial about that..."well it only rubs a bit"..
Some 185/60R13 will fit okay ...and not rub. Some willl...
A 175/65R13 will usually fit just fine....tough to find but an excellent choice....
An '81 X1/9 would have come with 165/70R13. Most any tire of that size will fit fine and not rub. A safe choice !!
A 155/80R13 or 175/70R13 tire - more easily available these days - WILL usually rub !! Many here are in denial about that..."well it only rubs a bit"..
Some 185/60R13 will fit okay ...and not rub. Some willl...
A 175/65R13 will usually fit just fine....tough to find but an excellent choice....
tvmaster
True Classic
Where do you suppose the 'rub' points are?
rx1900
1981 X1/9
Usually on the front lower part of the outer fender at partial lock...and the inner fender at full lock.
BTW.....usually not as bad on full lock on a '74...as they dont have as much rack travel...and no fender liners.....
Clatter
True Classic
Oh, man, thanks for the input gentlemen!
Really stoked to have skilled men put their eyes upon this sorry mess.
Will need to look up the VIN and see what/where the spec should be on this one.
Is there a place here that lists paint codes and when changes were made, etc?
Digging around and not coming up with what i need...
Like with the head. It was all bolts and no studs, so maybe late '81?
Definitely not a 14-bolt head.
The bolt that broke did so right below the head, unfortunately.
Rodent urine in mass quantities crystallizes very hard.
I'll have to try a bigger Martello - because schlepping across town to find out the tool won't work would suck!
Thanks again for the wisdom.
So far, the PO molestation has been minimal.
He bought it new, and seems to have mostly left it alone, save for what it took to go 170,000 miles...
His house was interesting, he was some kind of scientist - a really smart guy. Had this museum in his basement.
That can be good or bad of course,
But it was too bad i never got to meet the guy.
I'm sure he would have liked to see his car get saved.
I'll apologize in advance for doing the old quick/dirty with this one.
My oldest kid just grew up and moved away on us and my youngest only has another year and a half before he's gone.
If I'm going to have him drive the thing, I'll need to keep my retentivity in check.
While a K20 swap would be SO sweet and very tempting to jump in and go for it,
I know from past experience that sandblasting a car to a bare shell means it ain't just a couple of months' deal.
Additionally, i got carried away with making VW project cars beautiful and shiny,
And having a high-school kid rallying it around isn't in the cards.
Since i do my own paint/body, I try and get them to take my VW out,
But especially my youngest says he doesn't like dealing with the stress/responsibility.
Since this X is a marginally-presentable 20-footer, it would make a great daily hack to/from school.
Plus, Mom is NOT stoked I'm wasting more time/money on -another- project...
So, forgive my haste and desire to just gidder done.
Really, this first go-round is to get bolts turning and figure out what's glaringly wrong.
Since it's a Fiat, there will be work needing done after it's done,
So just having things clean and sorted, missing fasteners found, stripped threads chased, etc.
Trying to get the obvious things done so the hidden ones are easier to suss...
I also really appreciate guys digging into their trove to help us out.
Parts that get left over from a nice/proper build are perfect for this one.
Maybe if we fall in love with this car, it can come back apart one day to be done correctly.
In the meantime, the goal is to get it back on the road.
Really stoked to have skilled men put their eyes upon this sorry mess.
Will need to look up the VIN and see what/where the spec should be on this one.
Is there a place here that lists paint codes and when changes were made, etc?
Digging around and not coming up with what i need...
Like with the head. It was all bolts and no studs, so maybe late '81?
Definitely not a 14-bolt head.
The bolt that broke did so right below the head, unfortunately.
Rodent urine in mass quantities crystallizes very hard.
I'll have to try a bigger Martello - because schlepping across town to find out the tool won't work would suck!
Thanks again for the wisdom.
So far, the PO molestation has been minimal.
He bought it new, and seems to have mostly left it alone, save for what it took to go 170,000 miles...
His house was interesting, he was some kind of scientist - a really smart guy. Had this museum in his basement.
That can be good or bad of course,
But it was too bad i never got to meet the guy.
I'm sure he would have liked to see his car get saved.
I'll apologize in advance for doing the old quick/dirty with this one.
My oldest kid just grew up and moved away on us and my youngest only has another year and a half before he's gone.
If I'm going to have him drive the thing, I'll need to keep my retentivity in check.
While a K20 swap would be SO sweet and very tempting to jump in and go for it,
I know from past experience that sandblasting a car to a bare shell means it ain't just a couple of months' deal.
Additionally, i got carried away with making VW project cars beautiful and shiny,
And having a high-school kid rallying it around isn't in the cards.
Since i do my own paint/body, I try and get them to take my VW out,
But especially my youngest says he doesn't like dealing with the stress/responsibility.
Since this X is a marginally-presentable 20-footer, it would make a great daily hack to/from school.
Plus, Mom is NOT stoked I'm wasting more time/money on -another- project...
So, forgive my haste and desire to just gidder done.
Really, this first go-round is to get bolts turning and figure out what's glaringly wrong.
Since it's a Fiat, there will be work needing done after it's done,
So just having things clean and sorted, missing fasteners found, stripped threads chased, etc.
Trying to get the obvious things done so the hidden ones are easier to suss...
I also really appreciate guys digging into their trove to help us out.
Parts that get left over from a nice/proper build are perfect for this one.
Maybe if we fall in love with this car, it can come back apart one day to be done correctly.
In the meantime, the goal is to get it back on the road.
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tvmaster
True Classic
That may explain why I don't think I have any rubbing troubles?
rx1900
1981 X1/9
Okay.....if all 10 bolts are out........the head should come off fairly easily. just give it a couple of love taps....
No need to apologize . You have a great attitude on this. Dont turn this into a massive project hell......Get the head off and see what the bores and pistons look like...and go from there......
If I can make one suggestion to ease your project.......splurge on a gallon or two of this stuff:
Evapo-Rust™ Rust Remover - 1 Gallon
Amazing deals on this 1 Gallon Evapo-Rust Rust Remover at Harbor Freight. Quality tools & low prices.
www.harborfreight.com
Use one of those HF 20% off coupons. Or can sometimes be found at Home Depot or farm supply stores. But you may have trouble finding rust remover in California, haha. Looks like you really need it for the crank pulley, flywheel, etc. Trust me, the stuff works amazing. No muss, no fuss, just submerge the part in it for a day or two.
Clatter
True Classic
Mine hit at both lower corners of the wheel arch.
It would take quite a bit of metal work to get them to clear…
rx1900
1981 X1/9
Correct on both counts. And you likely did not notice them also rubbing on the inner fender sections....harder to see way in there.....
Dr.Jeff
True Classic
Absolutely nothing wrong with a "quick and dirty" build. Not every car needs to be a show car. And a young kids driver certainly shouldn't be.Oh, man, thanks for the input gentlemen!
Really stoked to have skilled men put their eyes upon this sorry mess.
Will need to look up the VIN and see what/where the spec should be on this one.
Is there a place here that lists paint codes and when changes were made, etc?
Digging around and not coming up with what i need...
Like with the head. It was all bolts and no studs, so maybe late '81?
Definitely not a 14-bolt head.
The bolt that broke did so right below the head, unfortunately.
Rodent urine in mass quantities crystallizes very hard.
I'll have to try a bigger Martello - because schlepping across town to find out the tool won't work would suck!
Thanks again for the wisdom.
So far, the PO molestation has been minimal.
He bought it new, and seems to have mostly left it alone, save for what it took to go 170,000 miles...
His house was interesting, he was some kind of scientist - a really smart guy. Had this museum in his basement.
That can be good or bad of course,
But it was too bad i never got to meet the guy.
I'm sure he would have liked to see his car get saved.
I'll apologize in advance for doing the old quick/dirty with this one.
My oldest kid just grew up and moved away on us and my youngest only has another year and a half before he's gone.
If I'm going to have him drive the thing, I'll need to keep my retentivity in check.
While a K20 swap would be SO sweet and very tempting to jump in and go for it,
I know from past experience that sandblasting a car to a bare shell means it ain't just a couple of months' deal.
Additionally, i got carried away with making VW project cars beautiful and shiny,
And having a high-school kid rallying it around isn't in the cards.
Since i do my own paint/body, I try and get them to take my VW out,
But especially my youngest says he doesn't like dealing with the stress/responsibility.
Since this X is a marginally-presentable 20-footer, it would make a great daily hack to/from school.
Plus, Mom is NOT stoked I'm wasting more time/money on -another- project...
So, forgive my haste and desire to just gidder done.
Really, this first go-round is to get bolts turning and figure out what's glaringly wrong.
Since it's a Fiat, there will be work needing done after it's done,
So just having things clean and sorted, missing fasteners found, stripped threads chased, etc.
Trying to get the obvious things done so the hidden ones are easier to suss...
I also really appreciate guys digging into their trove to help us out.
Parts that get left over from a nice/proper build are perfect for this one.
Maybe if we fall in love with this car, it can come back apart one day to be done correctly.
In the meantime, the goal is to get it back on the road.
Rod Midkiff
True Classic
I hope your comment about pulling the vin numbers and pushing it out.. Let Me know If you go that route. I do collect x1/9's..
My preference would be for you to get it running. They are fun cars!!.
I do have a 1500 out of a 79 that is supposed to run. (the only thing I know about is the car that it came out of got backed over via a garbage truck).
The X1/9 is a great first car. underpowered, so no fast speeds. Two seater so they don't have a lot of passengers. They hold up quite well in a collision. (I just lost one that got Hit hard when it was parked out front)
The pick-up was doing about 40 (in our 25). Both doors still open (the car is totaled but would have been survivable)
And they always have a GREAT cool factor. every time I stop and get fuel. people always come and talk about it!
My preference would be for you to get it running. They are fun cars!!.
I do have a 1500 out of a 79 that is supposed to run. (the only thing I know about is the car that it came out of got backed over via a garbage truck).
The X1/9 is a great first car. underpowered, so no fast speeds. Two seater so they don't have a lot of passengers. They hold up quite well in a collision. (I just lost one that got Hit hard when it was parked out front)
The pick-up was doing about 40 (in our 25). Both doors still open (the car is totaled but would have been survivable)
And they always have a GREAT cool factor. every time I stop and get fuel. people always come and talk about it!
Clatter
True Classic
So far I haven’t thrown in the towel just yet..!
Took really sick over the last couple days…!
Feeling a little better, the sun came out.
And it’s looking like a good day so far!
Martello!!!
Pistons came right out, skirts aren’t even scuffed, and there was no ridge to speak of.
There was this one piston that got wet, however…
Went and grabbed the dingleball hone to see if it would clean up.
I started getting all excited at this point!
No such luck.
Bummer..
Going to get this cleaned up for some measurements.
Will bring the block by a machinist to see if maybe a real hone could clean this up,
But knowing what i do about these things,
It’s probably going to need pistons and a bore job.
Took really sick over the last couple days…!
Feeling a little better, the sun came out.
And it’s looking like a good day so far!
Martello!!!
Pistons came right out, skirts aren’t even scuffed, and there was no ridge to speak of.
There was this one piston that got wet, however…
Went and grabbed the dingleball hone to see if it would clean up.
I started getting all excited at this point!
No such luck.
Bummer..
Going to get this cleaned up for some measurements.
Will bring the block by a machinist to see if maybe a real hone could clean this up,
But knowing what i do about these things,
It’s probably going to need pistons and a bore job.
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Clatter
True Classic
The kids finally got up and I barked them into motion…
What could make a father more proud?
Guess they really want to drive that car…
Just noticed he’s wearing his nice shoes!
Doh!
Buy the kid some high-dollar Air Jordans and what does he do?!??
Cleaning parts in gas… A long-standing family tradition passed down through the generations.
A lot safer now that nobody smokes.
What could make a father more proud?
Guess they really want to drive that car…
Just noticed he’s wearing his nice shoes!
Doh!
Buy the kid some high-dollar Air Jordans and what does he do?!??
Cleaning parts in gas… A long-standing family tradition passed down through the generations.
A lot safer now that nobody smokes.
Last edited:
Rod Midkiff
True Classic
That right there.. family doing things together!! You can't ask for more!!
Joe F
Hi Miles, Lo Maintenance
It never ceases to amaze me how much this little car can inspire true auto enthusiasts. Not only will your family gain a wealth of auto-knowledge (a dying art by the way), but you will eventually get one of the truly great rides the industry has ever produced. I am looking at your project and reflecting on the time spent with my son on my Fiats. I know the sacrifices you are going through, but as a family, you can endure.
Merry Christmas to you and your family!
Merry Christmas to you and your family!
Clatter
True Classic
Thanks for the kind words guys, and Merry Christmas Eve.
This does really make me happy, they're finally old enough to be some real help now(!)
Anyone who's tried to push an unwilling little kid into working on things knows it didn't come easy.
So, ever since those first few days I took really sick!
It's not hantavirus.. FWIW, that's only a threat for 4-5 days after rats are active, supposedly.
This thing i got, I'm feeling OK, but totally coughing up a lung.
Then working on stuff i get really run down and back to horizontal again.
My Mom, and their Mom, and the boys both badgered me into going to the clinic yesterday.
Don't want to go to no sissy-ass clinic just to get told i got the flu!
While they stayed and cleaned parts without me...
Needless to say, it took the whole afternoon, and while i don't have pneumonia again it's RSV so not exactly great.
They sent me this pic of cleaned parts on the garage floor to lift my spirits while i waited forever in an overcrowded clinic with a bunch of other sick people
(to get told i got the flu and be sent home).
I'm stuck sick in bed and they're out surfing with their buddies without me.
So, i get up and run out to measure some pistons and the block bore,
But then have a coughing fit and get all wheezy and dizzy...
See also big/heavy Harbor Freight suction cup dent puller.
Trying to convert it for use as a slide hammer to pull transaxle drive flanges.
The suction cup foot threads on, so if i can anchor a plate...
Had an hour between triage and my appointment, so ran off to ACE to get this big bolt.
Unfortunately, it's some odd size so won't fit without a lot of filing or grinding.
Also while i was gone, my machinist friend stopped over and eyed that bore on the block that got wet.
He also agreed to do the machine work for me!
His initial impression was that it would be good to take it over two sizes, because rust tends to creep more than you would guess.
In USA terms, two sizes over means .020", but here in Fiat world it's .0157" a.k.a. .4mm. Close enough.
Measuring my piston showed standard sizing, and the cylinders worn to a fit of .0035" or .0038" or thereabouts.
Looks like I'll need at least 86.8 or 87mm slugs.
Shopping around, places don't seem to have stock pistons.
MWB only shows Wisecos. Ebay has them for $375 plus shipping from Greece or Australia.
I really have trust issues with ebay, especially internationally.
Gotta love how these sellers from India list their 65mm pistons as "fits X1/9"
In VW world you can get a nice set of pistons -and- cylinders, hypereutectic, graphite coated and all for $166/set(!)
Sssooo... Who's got a set of oversized stock pistons for me?
Thinking the 'small cutout' carb/EU version would work well or even better.
I can run premium and tune carefully.
But,
Yeah,
I'm too poor to be picky.
Any pistons that work would be great.
Not guessing I'll be finding oversized pistons used, but one can hope!
Plenty of time to search - stuck sick in bed for days...
Thanks again for all of the interest, support and info you guys have given.
Really great forum and group here.
This does really make me happy, they're finally old enough to be some real help now(!)
Anyone who's tried to push an unwilling little kid into working on things knows it didn't come easy.
So, ever since those first few days I took really sick!
It's not hantavirus.. FWIW, that's only a threat for 4-5 days after rats are active, supposedly.
This thing i got, I'm feeling OK, but totally coughing up a lung.
Then working on stuff i get really run down and back to horizontal again.
My Mom, and their Mom, and the boys both badgered me into going to the clinic yesterday.
Don't want to go to no sissy-ass clinic just to get told i got the flu!
While they stayed and cleaned parts without me...
Needless to say, it took the whole afternoon, and while i don't have pneumonia again it's RSV so not exactly great.
They sent me this pic of cleaned parts on the garage floor to lift my spirits while i waited forever in an overcrowded clinic with a bunch of other sick people
(to get told i got the flu and be sent home).
I'm stuck sick in bed and they're out surfing with their buddies without me.
So, i get up and run out to measure some pistons and the block bore,
But then have a coughing fit and get all wheezy and dizzy...
See also big/heavy Harbor Freight suction cup dent puller.
Trying to convert it for use as a slide hammer to pull transaxle drive flanges.
The suction cup foot threads on, so if i can anchor a plate...
Had an hour between triage and my appointment, so ran off to ACE to get this big bolt.
Unfortunately, it's some odd size so won't fit without a lot of filing or grinding.
Also while i was gone, my machinist friend stopped over and eyed that bore on the block that got wet.
He also agreed to do the machine work for me!
His initial impression was that it would be good to take it over two sizes, because rust tends to creep more than you would guess.
In USA terms, two sizes over means .020", but here in Fiat world it's .0157" a.k.a. .4mm. Close enough.
Measuring my piston showed standard sizing, and the cylinders worn to a fit of .0035" or .0038" or thereabouts.
Looks like I'll need at least 86.8 or 87mm slugs.
Shopping around, places don't seem to have stock pistons.
MWB only shows Wisecos. Ebay has them for $375 plus shipping from Greece or Australia.
I really have trust issues with ebay, especially internationally.
Gotta love how these sellers from India list their 65mm pistons as "fits X1/9"
In VW world you can get a nice set of pistons -and- cylinders, hypereutectic, graphite coated and all for $166/set(!)
Sssooo... Who's got a set of oversized stock pistons for me?
Thinking the 'small cutout' carb/EU version would work well or even better.
I can run premium and tune carefully.
But,
Yeah,
I'm too poor to be picky.
Any pistons that work would be great.
Not guessing I'll be finding oversized pistons used, but one can hope!
Plenty of time to search - stuck sick in bed for days...
Thanks again for all of the interest, support and info you guys have given.
Really great forum and group here.
Last edited: