Bryce-o-rama
True Classic
I've never seen a test body or test engine bay before. That's a clever way to do it.
500 Abarth 1.4 Turbo swap.
- Thread starter Mike Schofield
- Start date
Mike Schofield
True Classic
Tony is a very clever man.
Mike Schofield
True Classic
Not all parts of an engine swap are exciting….here I’m starting to separate wiring looms for connectors to be removed that are not needed….
Bjorn Nilson
True Classic
That is the big drawback with stock ECU. You will probably need most of that spaghetti working to turn off warning lights and error codes.
ricar
True Classic
I'm thinking on my own cluster, not sure how feasible that will be be but it would get rid of most dummy lights. Also my engine is out of an '08 so there is not quite as much to worry about as later models.
kmead
Old enough to know better
So not a MulitAir?
Mike Schofield
True Classic
More progress with custom coolant piping fabricated using a home made jig and work on the inter cooler piping and set up commencing.
Bjorn Nilson
True Classic
A warning about the barrel type intercooler. It turned out to not be very inefficient on my Uno T build. I suffered from high intake temps until I changed to a rectangle shaped IC which is working much better. I am still not 100% satisfied so I will also upgrade the circulation pump. But by just changing the IC made a huge difference.
Also watch this video and I testify it is absolutely correct.
Also watch this video and I testify it is absolutely correct.
Jonohhh
True Classic
Curious about this as well. If it's a Tjet after all then I think a Squirt is the way to go.
The pictures Mike has posted are most definitely a MA engine though.
Iirc, MA w/ turbo first surfaced after 2009, and not in the 500. I believe it was first paired with a turbo in the Punto Evo. The USA Abarth was the first multiair turbo implementation in the 500 chassis, and that dates to 2012.
Bjorn Nilson
True Classic
If this is not an Multi Air engine why use the spaghetti loom and wiring? Go for a aftermarket ECU, save a lot of problems and get some serious power from the engine. Just saying.
ng_randolph
Bjorn H
Apparently it is a MultiAir engine. From Mike's first post in this thread:
"This thread will cover the swap of a 2012 500 Abarth 1.4l Mulitair Turbo engine into my 82 X 1/9."
"This thread will cover the swap of a 2012 500 Abarth 1.4l Mulitair Turbo engine into my 82 X 1/9."
Mike Schofield
True Classic
Tony can answer more specifically but I believe there is currently not an aftermarket ecu available for the MA turbo abarth engine…way, way complicated…
Mike Schofield
True Classic
Yes, indeed a multi air turbo engine.
TonyK
True Classic
When everything is installed as I have done on my car and Bob Martin's the only error codes are for the evaporative emissions, which the system components were not installed to allow it to function. The stock ECU does a lot and monitors the engine constantly, does not allow it to over heat, over boost or knock and all of that is a good thing because this little engine gets pushed to produce a lot of horse power and not grenade for the displacement of the engine.
TonyK.
Grimsby Ontario Canada.
TonyK
True Classic
Intercoolers are always an interesting topic and in a swap can be a challenge to fit and get the functionality that is hoped for. Looking at the stock Fiat Abarth intercooler or coolers they are split just in front of each of the front drive wheels. They are forced cooled by the car moving forward. They do not have fans and can basically cool the charge air to closely ambient temperatures if all is going correctly. Water to air intercoolers allow some latency as it takes awhile for the coolant in the intercooler circuit to warm up or cool down. All of my builds have a plenum temperature gauge mounted on the dash and an actual vacuum/boost gauge as well. I don't see the point of testing intercoolers on the bench when there are too many other factors affecting the entire cooling system. Sure differences in heat transfer can be noted, but actual driving gives more information that is relevant to engine performance and intercooler performance in actual road settings. Sitting in traffic on a hot sunny day allows the pavement to become very hot and that heat is absorbed by the intercooler rads in front of the car. For the intercooler to cool, it needs to dissipate heat and it cannot do that if the pavement is 140 degrees. I know, I have seen it happen as I watch the gauges in the car. When it is time to pull away, no cold charge air and the engine ECU pulls back on the power to protect the engine. My car has 5 small rads in the front i=of the car that equals the surface area of the Abarth air to air intercoolers. On 80 degree days or less the intercooler rarely gets above 100 degrees F. However 90 degree day, hot pavement and the intercooler will get to 160 degrees and the engine will pull back on the boost. Like I mentioned I have a line from the plenum that direct reads vacuum and boost. My car is running the Open Flash tune for 177HP. This is obtained by seeing boost pressures of 26PSI, ( more boost, more heat in the charge air) however when the engine is outside of parameters, boost is limited to about 18 PSI, which is stock for the Abarth car in sport mode. Bob Martin's car uses the air to air intercoolers with small fans sandwiched to each intercooler. Personally I wanted to put the intercoolers in the Dallara rear fenders but Bob wanted no part in modifying the body of the car as he paid $12,000 to have it painted. Bob picked the car up in December of 2019, we still had a few things to iron out as I was to go down in March and then Covid hit and I have not been able to get across the boarder to deal with the outstanding issues. Bob hopes to bring it to Freak Out in Texas and if all goes well I will also be there too with my car. So where are we going with variant #3. Mikes car an 82 I think, does not have Air Conditioning. The Abarth Engine is set up for A/C. So rather than delete the A/C we have decided to use the bottle intercooler and connect it to the A/C system with the Abarth A/C condenser in the front of the car. There is a company selling a product called Killer Chiller that taps into the car's A/C system through a liquid loop to an air to Water Intercooler. We hope to delete that intermediate loop and go directly so it would be an Air to R134a intercooler. Again plenum temperatures will be monitored, but watching the Killer Chiller video's on a 90 degree day the plenum temperatures are in the mid 60 degree range and that is something that no intercooler can obtain being air to air or air to water. I should say that some guys have an ICE BOX in the back trunk of their car where the water for the intercooler loop circulates through the ICE water and allows lower plenum charge temperatures, but that is not planned in this build. A temperature switch will be on the plenum to cycle the charge temperature when not needed. If it doesn't work, then we go back to Air to Water and copy what I have on my car.
Thanks for the comments, thoughts and wishes, that is what this form is all about, sharing thoughts and making ideas happen.
TonyK.
Grimsby Ontario Canada.
Mike Schofield
True Classic
Well said! I too think that the “bench test” isn’t going to give a real world scenario. Heat guns also don’t “push” a whole lot of air so not sure how effective that test is. Here is a couple other pictures of the intercooler and some modifications needed to work with the refrigerant.
“Modified the bottle intercooler. The issue at hand is that the return from the intercooler is too high for 134a refrigerant to circulate the compressor oil in the system. A discharge port was needed to be installed at the low point of the bottle intercooler. One of the problems was the wall thickness was unknown and the charge air tubes clearance to the outer case was also unknown. The cut for the new port was done on the milling machine and after .100" proceeded in .005" increments to avoid drilling through the case and hitting the charge air tubes. Once the hole was machined a new port was TIG welded to the body of the intercooler. The unused port will be plugged.”
ricar
True Classic
No, honestly I think this one will be a place holder. Truth be told it's an '08 Honda Fit lump. I can fit it in the bay with only cutting the engine mounts. The trans is close but I think it will be fine. IMO it'll get me over the 100hp mark and a more reliable trans and I can beat the crap out of it and no loss. I think my plan is to get it running then look into a B16 that I can build while having a drivable car. i did like the idea of a 500 engine but I wanted to go with something older, you are making me happy I went that way!
I know I can go aftermarket for the ECU but my goal with this engine was to go cheap as reasonable and just see what I cat do without cutting the car up. I wanted to take a readily available engine, small light, cheap, but respectable reliability. And just see what I can do. As for the future I'm not really sure, I don't think this engine will stay in the car but I don't want any forced induction or even A/C. I want something as easy to work on as I can get. The B16 is a respectable lump and old enough to be fairly simple. I'm not dedicated to it yet, I like the old Suzuki GTI engine as well. Who knows how long the FIT engine will stay.
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kmead
Old enough to know better
I was referencing Ricar’s post not the one in this build which is unequivacably the MultiAir.
Ricar stated his was a ‘08 which would not be a MultiAir.
However as he has clarified his 08 motor is a Honda Fit L15 type motor which is another matter entirely.
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